Thanks Howard
That would be useful if it met our needs; I haven’t found the SharePoint IT
person yet – they could be on the other side of the globe – so might take a
while before I get to have that conversation.
Do you know where the attached template is stored, and mapped, in this case?
Does it get saved to the Templates location or somewhere else?
This is the part that astounded me about this group working in the DOTM file,
is that it had no template support – no way to update styles if required, etc.
No way to attach a different template if you needed alternative building
blocks…
The startup macro is only one part of the equation; they will need access to
the attached template going forward to allow access to building blocks.
I’ve moved all the formatting macros into an addin pretending to be a global
addin (not stored in STARTUP) – so the only macros in the template are the
startup macros; which check for the Ribbon and load it.
They problem with putting RibbonX XML in a template rather than an addin, is
that it will error when the macros it requires aren’t present (with no fix
except to remove the Ribbon XML). Not a good look for customers who might need
to open the file as a docx..
If the Ribbon was created from within Word (ie not via XML) the behaviour might
be different, but won’t be sophisticated enough for what we need. Although, I
must admit I haven’t looked at that in depth.
Kind regards Suzy
Suzy Davis
Microsoft Word Templates, Apps for Microsoft Office
& Documentation Projects
www. <http://www.appsforoffice.com/> appsforoffice.com
(Melbourne) Australia
Email <mailto:suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: Word-Pc List [mailto:WORD-PC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Howard Silcock
Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 1:37 PM
To: WORD-PC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:WORD-PC@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: FW: Authors using DOTM files instead of DOCX files (cross posted
to austechwriter & LinkedIn)
Hi Suzy
I have only just got around to reading your email, so I'm a bit behind in the
discussion.
I'm not sure if you know that SharePoint document libraries allow you to load a
Word template as a 'content type'. Then an author can create a new document by
selecting a drop-down that gives them a choice of content types (ie templates),
some of which may be for Word documents and others for other things (eg Excel).
When the author does this, things work similarly to creating a document
normally from a template. First, the author is not opening the template or an
existing document loaded to the SharePoint site but creating a new document
based on the template. Secondly, if your template was a .DOTM containing
macros, then the author should be able to run the macros (assuming your
environment allows it). And if you have modified the Ribbon to contain controls
that run macros, these controls should work too.
So I think the problem you describe arises when people just load the template
as if it's just another document, which I suppose is a normal enough thing to
do if nobody's told them about content types.
I recently loaded a new Word template as a content type on a SharePoint site at
my work. It was a .DOTM and contained RibbonX code that allowed a user to
select a security classification for the document. I was doubtful whether that
would work, but it actually did! Once the author has selected the
classification they can then save the document as a .DOCX, though then they
can't, of course, modify the classification again.
I don't suppose this helps with the project you describe, as it sounds like it
would be too late to do anything about that, but it's something to keep in mind.
Regards
Howard
On Mon, 9 Oct 2017 at 2:48 pm, Jacques Raubenheimer <jrlistaddress@xxxxxxxxx
<mailto:jrlistaddress@xxxxxxxxx> > wrote:
Hi Suzy
Alas, I have seen this too, but nowhere near the scale you have just
described--that must be some kind of record (except that ignorance has no
limits).
I know this sound arrogant of me, but I think it is simply a case of people not
knowing what they are actually doing (as opposed to what they are supposed to
be doing). So you have someone knowing something, developing a solution (the
template with ribbon-activated macros), but there being no clear long term path
of implementation, so that those using the solution "do it wrong."
You are dead right in the approach you have recommended to them, so keep going
with that.
My experience, having presented many Word training courses over the last
decade, is that most Word users, even those who would call themselves
"experienced" Word users, don't know the difference between a template and a
document (heck, most people I came across didn't even know what Word templates
were).
Microsoft is partly to blame for this, with their (un-)helpful dumbing-down of
the way the interface works (I'm referring specifically to Windows here, but
choose your product) in the name of user-friendliness, when they removed the
explicit showing of file extensions in Windows Explorer, so that the only
differentiation is by file icon (most people don't even notice the difference
between the .do?x and .do?m icons).
So to answer your question. No, this is not unheard of. But yes, it is a recipe
for disaster (or at least a huge mess, which you have described).
Jacques Raubenheimer
---------------------------------------------
Want to learn more about Word?
Visit http://insight.trueinsight.za.com/categories/word/
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0868868140
---------------------------------------------
On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 10:02 AM, Suzy Davis <suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > wrote:
Hi there
(apologies – long post)
The question: How common is the practice of large author teams to use the
template file, DOTM to create their documents – some of which are 800 pages
long??
I’ve just deployed a new template brand refresh to a little over 22,000 authors
in a global engineering and consulting company.
As corporations often do, they thought bringing the template builder in
literally 4 weeks before the brand launch would be enough time. And they
wanted a macro refresh as well!
An interesting month that I survived, and delivered on time (although we had to
cut a few corners); but there wasn’t any time for document analysis; or the
analysis of the way people need to work.
They accepted that I just needed to do the job in the way I could do it and
achieve the deadline.
One of the main things I saw when I arrived was that authors were using DOTM
files in documents, with an embedded custom Ribbon. I was notified that these
documents error when the documents are sent to customers or external
collaborators when the macros are taken out (many mail servers won’t accept
DOCM OR DOTM files). This means that the resulting DOCX with the Ribbon XML
still embedded (as an author won’t know how to take it out) will error when
that document is opened. They’ve just learn to live and accept that.
The documents are deployed via SharePoint.
I don’t know much about SharePoint. When people open the DOTM in SharePoint it
opens the DOTM file on their PC and they happily continue working in it. Even
when they save as, they don’t notice that it’s a DOTM file; and if they did and
saved it as a DOCX, they would lose macros etc.
I took one look at that and said I’ll move you towards a Microsoft Best
Practice approach – which was to add a macro into the DOTM file, that when
saved to the PC, will save it to a template location, and force the start of a
new document, and load the ribbon from an external addin. This forces people
to work in the DOCX files not the DOTM files.
The new Ribbon (with macros) is loaded as a global addin (currently via a
SharePoint download and self install), and their new documents are all attached
to a template in a common location (not under the user profile – yet) which
holds the macros and building blocks.
I’d like to move them to a Word\Startup global addin location, and a template
deployment where IT push the templates out rather than people needing to open
from SharePoint (at least for the base corporate templates) – but that will
likely take a year of discussion with IT.
Is this a common practice – working in the DOTM??
First time I’ve encountered it, and I was shocked that someone would consider
that as an option, and can only imagine that they did so while fairly
inexperienced and needing to appease a demanding corporate stakeholder under a
tight timeframe.
In companies deploying templates via Intranets or SharePoint I’ve more commonly
seen DOCX files deployed as templates.
Because of the way they’ve been working they are used to the Ribbon only being
present when they have the document (DOTM) open, and otherwise it’s not there.
With my method there is some confusion because people are expecting the Ribbon
to work no matter what document is open – but Ribbons only work in when the
building blocks, or styles are present in the current document.
To me it’s the same as trying to use your Bank app on your phone when the phone
is out of range. You get a message that that button won’t work in this
document, and move on.
From my point of view this is a maintenance nightmare. If they need new
building blocks or macros, or ribbon alternations we just update the templates,
or the ribbon file, and tell people to download the updated template or ribbon.
They would have no way to deploy these updates, except by telling people to
copy their document into the new template. Just what someone needs in an 800
page document on a time crunch. Seems bizarre to me, but maybe I’ve been
working the way I’ve been working (and avoiding corporates) for too long!
Would love to hear your thoughts…
Kind regards Suzy
Suzy Davis
Microsoft Word Templates
APPS for MICROSOFT OFFICE
& Documentation Projects
<http://www.appsforoffice.com/> www.appsforoffice.com
<http://www.appsforinteriordesigners.com/> www.appsforinteriordesigners.com
Email <mailto:suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> suzy.davis@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Skype suzy.davis
-- mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to leave
mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to join (no subject
or command text required) http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/archives/word-pc.html
-- mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to leave
mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to join (no subject
or command text required) http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/archives/word-pc.html ;
-- mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-unsubscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to leave
mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ;
<mailto:mailto:word-pc-subscribe-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> to join (no subject
or command text required) http://listserv.liv.ac.uk/archives/word-pc.html ;
