Hi all, The list has been pretty quiet lately. However, since I was not going to Wichita and Matt was I ask him to get with their APT people and see what a commercial version looks like. And the answer is: not much different that APT360. I think what it comes down to is that their programmers are simply experienced and very good. So no magic bullet in terms of ideas for making programming easier. Brent has been rather quiet lately also so I have no idea what is going on if anything. Dave