Dear Ian, Your idea for a sire referencing program is a good first step in that it will provide a relatively standardized set of phenotypic data that ought to be available, but usually isn't, on any herdsire that any breeder wishes to use for stud services. It will be helpful in improving selection accuracy, one of the four factors of Bourdon's Key Equation for increasing the rate of genetic gain, as I described in my chapters for your handbook (which will be published someday?). The other three factors being selection intensity, genetic variation and generation interval. Since financial factors make it difficult for us in the alpaca industry today to exert much selection pressure, particularly on the female side, selection accuracy becomes even more important if we are to have any significant rate of genetic gain in our breeding. Your sire reference program, as described, will help with accuracy of phenotypic selection of sires, and this is a good first step. Phenotypic selection is of course the most basic method of estimating breeding values. The next step would be to record exactly the same data in the same way on the breeding females and then even more importantly on the offspring. An even better plan is to step beyond phenotypic selection. As I said in my article, "Selection of each alpaca, based only on phenotypic record, is not very accurate, particularly if the heritability of the traits under consideration is low. Greater accuracy in estimating breeding values can be achieved by using more information and more sophisticated genetic prediction technology." At this juncture the most sophisticated genetic prediction technology available to livestock breeders is to use BLUP (Best Linear Unbiased Prediction). I have been working with two different geneticists, each of which has decades of experience writing BLUP programs to generate EPDs and ETAs for other livestock, for the last three years preparing just such a program for use in our alpaca breeding program. The goal is to maximize the rate of genetic gain and become a producer of superior studs that can be referenced by your program. As you remember I spoke a bit about the mating strategy for my program at one of your seminars. Here comes the commercial. I need more good foundation breeding stock and some equipment to get this program to the next level. Therefore, for any interested investors, I have set up a business plan to sell shares in this endeavor. Those who invest will then own a share of all of the foundation stock, as well as any of the offspring produced including the genetically superior studs we expect to breed down the road as a result of this scientifically designed and operated breeding program. Also, if the investors are also alpaca breeders, they will have first option to breed their females to any of the studs produced as well as first option to buy any of the animals that are for sale out of this program. In addition, once this business plan is in effect and all of the remaining investors are on board, we will open up the BLUP program to other farms that want to confidentially submit the data on their animals so that they too can get computer generated Estimated Progeny Differences on their breeding stock which will help them to increase their rate of genetic gain and develop the best possible sires on their farms to reference in your program as well. Anyone seriously interested in owning shares of this scientifically designed breeding program and the future generations it will produce can contact me privately by e-mailing journal@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx . Those interested in reading up on the details of using quantitative genetics technology in this way, or who want to do the same thing in their breeding programs, can see my chapters in your book, my previous articles in Alpacas Magazine, or any good textbook on the Genetics of Animal Breeding such as Richard Bourdon's book by the same title. Now that you are "Up Over" (as opposed to "Down Under") I am hoping that we can see each other more often. Cheers and Good Health, Wayne Jarvis Sixth Day Farm --- List Name: Alpaca Fibre Production ListAddress: alpaca_fibre@xxxxxxxxxxxxx List Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/alpaca_fibre/ List Administrator: Ian Watt (alpacaconsult@xxxxxxxxxxxxx) How to Unsubscribe: send an email to alpaca_fibre-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx and put "unsubscribe" (without the quotes) in the Subject line of the email.