[access-uk] Re: Orion Webbox review - clarification
- From: "Jamie Cuthbertson" <jamie.cuthbertson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 20:41:22 -0000
Ray,
I don't know much about politics so tend to try to keep out of this but, at
present, the situation is really simple and I think that there is a risk of
this snowballing out of control in terms of rumour control.
At present there is no RNIB agenda other than to take stock of the
evaluation and to start discussions, internally and externally, about how to
take this forward. Believe it or not, it's as simple as that! No cloaks
and daggers, no gun powder plots and no underhand treachery that some may
wish to read into the situation.
It should also be pointed out that the Orion is not the only such box.
There are other devices in the market, all of which have good points and bad
points. I'm sure that there are also boxes that we have not yet come
across. It would be foolish not to look at all the evidence before planning
the way forward. I think this is pretty obvious but who am I?
Regarding costs of sending the boxes backwards and forwards,, I think you
are a bit off the mark here because:
1. Boxes of this sort, which have been modified to be used by blind people,
are eligible to be sent Articles for the Blind and
2. There is no need to return the box for the playlist to be modified in
any case - this is simply done on the server system.
User control is one of the key factors that needs to be discussed in the
forthcoming weeks and months and indeed was a major point in the evaluation.
The box could be customised via the internet using a password and the unique
serial number of the webbox so this is a possibility for the future. It
could potentially be modified via a phone call to a support line i.e. there
could be different methods for different users.
I know that many people like a good old dig at RNIB, and I would hate to
deprive them of this fun, but, as I said previously, RNIB has no fixed
agenda at present and is waiting to review all the possible options,
starting with the forthcoming meetings in early April. Until these meetings
have taken place and decisions have been made, RNIB is not committed one way
or other.
I hope this helps clarify things a bit more.
Regards,
Jamie
-----Original Message-----
From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Ray's Home
Sent: 28 March 2008 19:23
To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Orion Webbox review - clarification
Jackie, Paul, and everyone, it does seem very sad that this web box is
getting mixed up with vol sector politics and agendas.
It's not as though I cannot see the attraction of this device for RNIB
and TNAUK in terms of speeding up and cheapening distribution of
material and news making it available in a more immediate fashion.
At present though a considerable cost falls on the consumer and quite
probably a lot of hassle too regarding possible changed URLS and
sending the thing back for alterations to the menus to be made. To
have such a crippled unit so dependent on being tied to the mother
organisations apron strings seems perverse to me. Is it that a new
income stream (sic) is being sought as well as benefits to
distribution of audio news and information?
So many blind people could obviously update these units themselves
that this does seem to be a rather obvious ploy to stop us doing it
for ourselves, instead having to rely on a not always very competent
organisation to do it for us. Need I cite the example of the mess the
talking book library has got itself into over the last six months and
more? I believe TNAUK has its own problems too according to one user
of their services I know.
All of this said, I'm willing to listen to arguments supporting why
we're being lumbered, seemingly, with this way of doing things.
From Ray
I can be contacted off-list at:
mailto:ray-48@xxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
Paul Leake
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Orion Webbox review - clarification
my sense is that if this product is going to be a runner, users will
need to
be able to select internet sstations themselves. after all such
products
should be about promoting independence not dependency on what an
organisation thinks the blind might wish to use! It seems to me that
potoentially this product might superficially appeal to people who
feel
unable to cope with complex computer equipment but they should still
be
afforded the same opportunities as a fully sighted person buying an
internet
radio particularly given the price of this unit!
Cheers
Paul
paul.leake@xxxxxxxxxxxx
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jamie Cuthbertson" <jamie.cuthbertson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 6:28 PM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Orion Webbox review - clarification
> Jackie,
>
> Many thanks for the update and I quite agree about the politics!!
(smile)
>
> I just wanted everyone on the list to be clear about the current
line RNIB
> is taking and for there to be no confusion or misunderstanding about
this.
> Hopefully this has now been done.
>
> I guess that you don't really want paid in peanuts anyway!!? (Smile)
>
> All the best for now,
>
> Jamie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf
> Of
> Jackie Cairns
> Sent: 28 March 2008 17:49
> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Orion Webbox review - clarification
>
>
> Hi Jamie
>
> Thanks for clarifying RNIB's position, both privately and on this
list.
>
> I would add that when I asked SoundTalking if I could write a review
of
> the
> Orion Web Box, they agreed on the condition that I sought permission
from
> Ted Davis before any such article could be published.
>
> So, having written the review this week, I indeed sent it to Ted for
his
> approval. He "specifically" asked me not to send it to RNIB for
> publication
>
> at this stage, which I haven't, and that I could distribute it among
Email
> lists, which I have done.
>
> So, as far as I personally am concerned, I tried out the Orion Web
Box to
> solve my own curiosity to see if it was the path I wanted to take,
and to
> write a fair and balanced review to let others know of its existence
and
> features.
>
> Ted gave me all the information regarding the participants involved,
so if
> this is incorrect, then he must be responsible for that as he
sanctioned
> the
>
> review after it was written.
>
> Personally, I think everyone wants their heads banging together over
this.
> It's a bloody tool for the end user, and why politics have to come
into
> play
>
> I honestly don't know and don't care. I wouldn't buy it anyway, and
I
> haven't been paid so much as a peanut for writing the review. I did
it
> because I wanted to. (smiles.)
>
> Thanks Jamie for clarifying. I have sent a good number of reviews
> privately, so hope it has proved useful, which was always my
intention.
>
> Jackie
>
>
> Email: cairnsplace@xxxxxxx
> Skype Name: Cairnsplace
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jamie Cuthbertson" <jamie.cuthbertson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Friday, March 28, 2008 5:20 PM
> Subject: [access-uk] Orion Webbox review - clarification
>
>
>> Hi list,
>>
>> I read Jackie's review of the Orion Webbox with interest and would
like
>> to
>> clarify a little of the detail. First a bit of background to
explain my
>> link with the Orion Webbox. I apologise in advance for the length
of
>> this
>> posting.
>>
>> Last year I was asked to run a trial of the Orion Webbox on RNIB's
behalf
>> and this started around April/May. We trialled the unit with
around 90
>> participants, living mainly in the Glasgow and Gloucestershire
areas. A
>> thorough evaluation of the system was conducted in October. The
>> evaluation
>> report was finished earlier this year.
>>
>> For the purposes of the trial, RNIB made available a selection of
>> internet
>> radio stations, talking books, magazines and newspapers and
podcasts, on
>> each of the playlists. This playlist is different from, though
similar
>> to,
>> that offered by Sound Talking.
>>
>> Although the official trial period is over, some of our trialists
still
>> have
>> their webboxes and can access the playlist that was provided.
>>
>> As yet, however, there has been no decision taken about how long
this
>> will
>> be the case.
>>
>> For clarification, in Jackie's article, she says "In addition, both
RNIB
>> and
>> Calibre have included talking books which they say they will update
at
>> regular intervals."
>>
>> I cannot comment on behalf of Calibre, however, I think it is only
fair
>> to
>> point out that the RNIB Talking Books that are currently available
on the
>> Sound Talking playlist are only sample titles that were made
available to
>> the Sound Talking trialists, who participated in a similar trial at
the
>> end
>> of 2007 and into early 2008. There is no plan at present to
change,
>> amend
>> or add to this list of books - they are only samples to show what
can be
>> done.
>>
>> The general feedback from our trialists was that this kind of
technology
>> provides very exciting possibilities, but there is a great deal of
>> discussion still to be had around issues such as content, how
multiple
>> organisations can participate, standards, features, user control of
>> playlists and so on. In the next few weeks there are due to be
meetings
>> to
>> take forward this discussion and these will bring together many of
the
>> organisations which currently have a vested interested in the
subject.
>>
>> Having completed the evaluation process reasonably recently, it is
>> entirely
>> right and proper that all organisations that wish to investigate a
future
>> service of this type, take an appropriate amount of time to
thoroughly
>> investigate all the issues in order to ensure that, if a service is
to be
>> established, that it meets all the needs of the end users. This is
the
>> approach that RNIB is currently taking and I'm sure that you will
agree
>> that
>> this is sensible.
>>
>> I hope this clarifies the existing situation. If anyone wishes to
be
>> sent
>
>> a
>> copy of the RNIB trial evaluation of the Orion Webbox, please feel
free
>> to
>> contact me at my RNIB email address:
>>
>> Jamie.cuthbertson@xxxxxxxxxxx
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Jamie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> mentions that both RNIB and Calibre content is available and that
>>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
>> ----
>>
>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf
>> Of
>> Jackie Cairns
>> Sent: 27 March 2008 17:33
>> To: Access UK Mailing List
>> Subject: [access-uk] Solutions In A Box? - Orion Web Box Internet
Radio
>> Review
>>
>>
>>
>> Due to popular demand, I have been asked to post the below review
to the
>> list. Draw your own conclusions from its contents, and I'm happy
to
>> answer
>> any questions that I can.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jackie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> SOLUTIONS IN A BOX?
>>
>> THE ORION WEB BOX INTERNET RADIO
>>
>> JACKIE CAIRNS
>>
>>
>>
>> There are now thousands of radio stations worldwide that one may
tune
>> into
>> over the Internet. And this way of accessing radio has become so
popular
>> that several manufacturers such as Intempo and Roberts have brought
out
>> stand-alone devices that allow you to listen to your favourite
programmes
>> without using a PC.
>>
>>
>>
>> But while Internet radio, as it is known, is commercially available
and
>> affordable, it isn't accessible for those with little or no sight.
With
>> so
>> much material to choose from, operating an Internet radio if you
don't
>> have
>> enough vision to read the display is a daunting prospect. But
thanks to
>> the
>> collaboration of Dutch company Solutions Radio, and UK charity
>> SoundTalking
>> - which is the commercial outlet of the popular Talking Newspaper
>> Association of the United Kingdom (TNAUK) - an Internet radio with
speech
>> feedback is now available.
>>
>>
>>
>> This piece reviews a trial Orion Web Box, supplied by SoundTalking,
and
>> outlines what users may expect from the service in the coming
months.
>>
>>
>>
>> CONTROLS AND FEATURES
>>
>>
>>
>> The Orion Web Box is a sturdy rectangular-shaped device in
contrasting
>> black
>> and grey colours. It is slightly sloped so that the back is higher
than
>> the
>> front, with a speaker, all its controls, and small display
positioned on
>> the
>> top.
>>
>>
>>
>> When the Web Box is facing you, the speaker grill occupies the
portion
>> towards the back of the machine, with small display, five buttons
and
>> rotary
>> volume control/mute/pause/bookmark facility nearer to the front.
A
>> mains
>> outlet, RJ45 ethernet connection, two phono sockets and phone
connectors
>> are
>> at the rear of the unit.
>>
>>
>>
>> The five round buttons are arranged in a sighted L-shape further to
the
>> front of the unit. The first one is up, below which is down, below
which
>> is
>> the OK or Accept button. To the right of the OK is Back, followed
by
>> On/Off. The rotary volume/mute/pause/bookmark control is in the
middle
>> of
>> the L-shape, and is very distinctive to feel and turn. To mute or
pause
>> what you are listening to, simply press down the rotary control,
and
>> press
>> again to continue. The control, when pressed down and held, also
acts as
>> a
>> bookmark facility.
>>
>>
>>
>> The small display comprises black text on a yellow background. But
as a
>> totally blind person, I could not say how easy this would be to use
for
>> those with limited sight.
>>
>>
>>
>> In the middle of the front edge of the Web Box is a small round
sensor
>> which
>> detects the accompanying remote control. This small hand-held
control
>> allows the same functionality as the Web Box itself.
>>
>>
>>
>> Before turning on the Web Box, it needs to be mains powered and
connected
>> to
>> the accompanying ethernet cable to provide access to the Internet.
Once
>> this is done, press the bottom right button to switch on the
device. A
>> few
>> short beeps indicates that the Web Box has power, and is proceeded
by the
>> following: "Hello and welcome to SoundTalking Internet radio.
Press the
>> OK
>> button when you hear the subject of your choice. You can choose
from:
>> Announcements; Bookmark Facility; National Radio Stations; Local
Radio
>> Stations; Local Talking Newspapers; National Talking Newspapers and
>> Magazines; SoundTalking Publications; Soundings Magazine; Info
Sound;
>> Music
>> for Blind; Calibre Books; RNIB Talking Books; Podcasts; Useful
>> Information
>> on the Orion Web Box." You may intercept this list of choices at
any
>> point
>> by pressing the OK button to enter a sub-menu with further choices.
>> Alternatively, if you know the choices off by heart, you can
quickly go
>> up
>> and down to find the item you want more rapidly using the buttons
>> described
>> above. At the end of the list read out, the voice continues with:
"As
>> you
>> have made no choice, this menu will be repeated."
>>
>>
>>
>> As you have now discovered, the Orion Web Box is more than just an
>> Internet
>> radio. It has been designed to accept the entire range of TNAUK
>> publications which is an annual subscription service. In addition,
both
>> RNIB and Calibre have included talking books which they say they
will
>> update
>> at regular intervals. These publications may be bookmarked, with a
>> current
>> limit of up to 10.
>>
>>
>>
>> As an avid radio listener, and most anxious to access this aspect
of the
>> Orion Web Box, I discovered that the trial unit contains only 25
national
>> and 14 local stations which may be increased on request to
SoundTalking.
>> These stations are all easily accessed by choosing either the
national or
>> local radio stations list from the main menu, and then selecting
the
>> preferred station from the sub-menu. Again, the list will be
repeated if
>> you make no selection, and just pressing the OK button allows you
to make
>> your choice. A series of beeps ensues while you wait for your
selected
>> radio station to commence.
>>
>>
>>
>> The speech menus are clear and straightforward to follow. No prior
>> computer
>> knowledge is required to operate the Web Box, apart from the fact
you
>> must
>> have an Internet connection so that the radio can find the
necessary
>> information.
>>
>>
>>
>> For those who prefer to use Wi-Fi, or wireless connectivity, a
model of
>> the
>> Web Box supporting this capability is available for an extra
charge.
>>
>>
>>
>> I was disappointed to discover that the Orion Web Box is only a
mono
>> radio,
>> both from its external speaker and through headphone listening. A
>> supplied
>> lead with two phono jacks at one end can be connected to the rear
of the
>> Web
>> Box, with a 3.5MM socket at the other that allows attachment to
your own
>> headphones. It looks like a stereo device because of its two phono
>> sockets,
>> but it is, in fact, mono.
>>
>>
>>
>> The Orion Web Box is available in two flavours from SoundTalking.
The
>> standard ethernet version costs £279, and the wireless option £315.
This
>> is
>> in stark contrast to commercially available Internet radios which
cost
>> from
>> £99 to £200. The commercial alternatives also support
approximately
>> 6,000
>> stations worldwide, and update automatically when new channels are
added.
>> You can choose from country or genre when browsing these radios,
and some
>> even offer the facility to allow you to listen to your own music
>> collections
>> from your PC.
>>
>>
>>
>> But, as already stated, such an appetising prospect is impossible
without
>> sufficient sight. At present, therefore, we are faced with a
limited
>> option
>> in the form of the Orion Web Box. It is limited because all
stations
>> need
>> to be added by SoundTalking. All stations are also tagged, which
means
>> that
>> they have to be voice labelled so that the user may identify them.
When
>> a
>> station therefore goes out of date, or changes its name, the
original
>> speech
>> label, or tag, doesn't automatically update, and needs to be
altered
>> manually. This is costly for the suppliers to upkeep, and is
dependent
>> upon
>> regular maintenance.
>>
>>
>>
>> Both partners in this project have assured me that anyone wishing
to have
>> a
>> radio station of their choice added to the Orion Web Box can do so
by
>> contacting SoundTalking. They also insist the unit will be updated
>> regularly with a variety of books and information from other
sources.
>> And
>> they have stated that they will support anyone who purchases an
Orion Web
>> Box regardless of whether or not they take out a Talking Newspapers
>> subscription.
>>
>>
>>
>> CONCLUSIONS
>>
>>
>>
>> This is a compact device with a lot of practicability for those who
are
>> not
>> particularly computer literate, yet want to listen to a variety of
radio
>> stations, or TNAUK/RNIB/Calibre publications in one solution. It
is easy
>> to
>> use, and contains a straightforward set of print and audio
instructions.
>> There is clearly enormous potential for the unit to be developed
further,
>> particularly the radio aspect.
>>
>>
>>
>> I do have concerns, however, about long term support for the Web
Box.
>> While
>> trials and user feedback have been positive, I cannot help
wondering what
>> sort of shelf life such a device will have if it needs constant
speech
>> tagging and manual maintenance to ensure everything is kept
up-to-date.
>>
>>
>>
>> For further information, contact SoundTalking on 01435 862737, send
an
>> Email
>> to info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, or visit
>>
>> http://www.soundtalking.co.uk/internet-radio-service.html.
>>
>>
>>
>> Glasgow - Proud Host City of the 2014 Commonwealth Games
>>
>>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
>> Disclaimer:
>> This message is intended only for use of the addressee. If this
message
>> was sent to you in error, please notify the sender and delete this
>> message.
>> Glasgow City Council cannot accept responsibility for viruses, so
please
>> scan attachments. Views expressed in this message do not
necessarily
>> reflect
>> those of the Council who will not necessarily be bound by its
contents.
>>
** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
** and in the Subject line type
** unsubscribe
** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
** immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
** or send a message, to
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe]
** If this link doesn't work then send a message to:
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
** and in the Subject line type
** unsubscribe
** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the
** immediately-following link:-
** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq]
** or send a message, to
** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the Subject:- faq
Other related posts:
