Andy, I'd strongly suggest you listen to David Woodbridge's Vision Australia podcasts on getting started. In particular he talks about which keyboard set-up you need and how to change it. Ian Macrae Editor Disability Now 6 Market Road London N7 9PW ++44 20 7619 7760 ext 7760 ++44 7824 900855 www.disabilitynow.org.uk<http://www.disabilitynow.org.uk> Follow us: @disabilitynow On 20 Jun 2013, at 08:49, Gordon Keen wrote: Hi I'm not Ian but am sitting at a mac book air right now and pressing the v+o keys with f8 does bring up the voice over utility app, to close it you need command+w Because you have described the keys that bring up the extras menu I suggest you have the keyboard set up slightly differently to me and I presume Ian so you will need to use the fn key with v+o and f8 to get to the v+o utility app.Regards G From Bridgerule in glorious Devon, England. On 19 Jun 2013, at 18:18, ANDY COLLINS <Andy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:Andy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote: Thanks Ian - are you using a MacBook Air, or a Mac Pro? I'm wondering if there are some differences, as the key strokes you refer to, such as VO keys and f8, doesn't open VO, in fact, the only key combination in conjunction with f8 that does anything, is function key and control and f8, which brings up an 'extendede menu.' In there it tells me about Bluetooth, wi-fi strength, clock and battery status, still useful, as I was looking for the battery info, but nothing for Voice Over. I also new about and tried VO keys with command, and used the arrow keys to get to voice, but the only one there was Daniel [compact.] Anders has also told me of some key strokes, such as control s to launch Safari, but that too doesn't work on this machine, and neither does pressing VO keys and f1 twice bring up the app chooser. In fact, pressing f1 on it's own, and pressing it with the VO keys makes no difference, that function key is about brightness, so is the f2 key! ** To leave the list, click on the immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=unsubscribe] ** If this link doesn't work then send a message to: ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> ** and in the Subject line type ** unsubscribe ** For other list commands such as vacation mode, click on the ** immediately-following link:- ** [mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=faq] ** or send a message, to ** access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:access-uk-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with the Subject:- faq