[access-uk] Re: Chip and pin and checking amounts was RE: Re: Trust me with your change
- From: "Chris" <christopherhallsworth71@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 05 Jun 2008 11:36:36 +0100
Hi, I'm on about any case where a chip and pin card is used. I only said ATM as
a prime and common example.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Peter Beasley" <pjbeasley@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2008 11:22:11 +0100
Subject: [access-uk] Re: Chip and pin and checking amounts was RE: Re: Trust me
with your change
> What are we onabout here? are we talking about ATM'S or using your chip and
> pin card in a shop. I use my card in the supermarket and my local pub all
> the time. You always get a receipt which yu can get someone to check.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chris" <christopherhallsworth71@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 10:43 AM
> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Chip and pin and checking amounts was RE: Re: Trust
> me with your change
>
>
> >
> > Hi Martin and all, the best thing to do when you want to use your chip and
> > pin card is to bring a sighted trustworthy volunteer, such as a
> > careworker. That way they can not only check that what you're doing is
> > right, but also they can check you got the correct amount of money and,
> > the main thing, read the prompts to you displayed on the ATM's screen.
> > Hope this helps.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "martin wilsher" <m.wilsher@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: Thu, 5 Jun 2008 10:02:12 +0100
> > Subject: [access-uk] Chip and pin and checking amounts was RE: Re: Trust
> > me with your change
> >
> >> Hi all. Carrying on from the "trust me with your change," thread,
> >> I thought I'd add this little piece into the mix. How do we, as blind
> >> people, know the person who is tapping the amounts to be paid by us into
> > the
> >> chip and pin machines are entirely honest all the time? I know there is
> > a
> >> chance to check the amount before you type in your pin, but how do we as
> >> blind people do this? I use chip and pin all the time, but as we know,
> > the
> >> safeguards for debit and credit card transactions are not unified, so
> > how
> >> safe is chip and pin really? Has anyone been ripped off this way?
> >> Fortunately I haven't been, but there is always the potential for this
> > kind
> >> of thing to happen to anyone who cannot check the amount. Any thoughts?
> >>
> >> Hope to hear from you soon.
> >>
> >> From Martin.
> >>
> >> Please email me at:
> >>
> >> m.wilsher@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >>
> >>
> >> Please visit my website:
> >>
> >> www.martin-wilsher.co.uk
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
> > Of
> >> Iain Lackie
> >> Sent: 05 June 2008 09:08
> >> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Trust me with your change
> >>
> >> I have never had any trouble with either notes or change. If I have had
> > any
> >> queries, they have concerned with being given too much change rather
> > than
> >> too little.
> >>
> >> Iain
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Andy" <andy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 12:52 AM
> >> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Trust me with your change
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Husna.
> >>
> >> You speak a lot of common sense mate" We don't actually check our money
> >> minute to minute and we place far too much trust in sighted folks. I'm
> > for
> >> one, am going to start getting a grip of this and tell the bank to give
> > me
> >> £5.00 notes, rather then £20.00. Although people may call you by your
> >> christian name and you believe that these people like and trust you, you
> > are
> >> the buyer and need to remain above this. Sooner or or later they will
> > let
> >> you down, despite the relationship you may think occurs between you and
> >> them.. I'm vastly coming to the conclusion that shop workers are not my
> >> friends at all. The are Robots and I need to stay one step before them.
> >> They are working for £5.75 an hour and will take any opportunity to
> > improve
> >> this, regardless of your disability. So from now on, all shop keepers
> > are
> >> no longer my friends. They are service providers and I am the customer.
> >> It's a shame really as I rather enjoyed being part of the community. I
> >> suppose I've lost my trust in them.
> >>
> >> Andy
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Husna Begum" <mail@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> Sent: Thursday, June 05, 2008 12:23 AM
> >> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Trust me with your change
> >>
> >>
> >> > so far I i have relied on their honesty as well although I do feel
> > some
> >> > disquiet about doing this some times but what can you do? it's
> > difficult
> >> > to
> >> > know whether they've given you a £5 note or £10 note if there is only
> > 1
> >> > note
> >> > there. what they should do is have different textured paper for the
> >> > different notes.also do all of you always know exactly how much you've
> > got
> >> > in 20s and 10s or do you some times forget to check before you left
> > the
> >> > house?
> >> >
> >> > Husna
> >> >
> >> > ----- Original Message -----
> >> > From: "Andy" <andy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> > To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 9:00 PM
> >> > Subject: [access-uk] Re: Trust me with your change
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> nHi Mark.
> >> >>
> >> >> You are absolutely right of course. My lack of confidence to seek
> >> >> clarification of any change is a different issue and as you said, I
> > did
> >> >> leave the shop. I just feel so very very uneasy about seeking
> >> > confirmation
> >> >> with change. How do I do this? Do I need to seek out another
> > customer
> >> > and
> >> >> ask them to confirm? It's so much easier to burry your head in the
> > sand
> >> > and
> >> >> hop for trust in people. No longer. As I mentioned in an earlier
> >> > message,
> >> >> I'm going to ask the bank for £5.00 notes rather than £20.00 from now
> > on,
> >> > so
> >> >> perhaps I can be a bit more proactive at the time of purchase rather
> > than
> >> >> afterwards. Interesting point though. We all know that many
> > visually
> >> >> impaired people lack confidence so how do they cope with challenging
> >> > queries
> >> >> relating to change etc.
> >> >>
> >> >> best wishes.
> >> >>
> >> >> Andy.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> >> From: "Mark Threadgold" <m.j.threadgold@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> >> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 03, 2008 8:10 PM
> >> >> Subject: [access-uk] Re: Trust me with your change
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> > Andy,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I don't think you have a leg to stand on if you try and involve any
> >> >> > sort
> >> >> > of
> >> >> > legal argument with this firm. The fact is that you did not check
> > your
> >> >> > change. Had you done it there and then it would not have become an
> >> > issue,
> >> >> > and the fact you left the shop without doing so means you cannot
> > say
> >> >> > either
> >> >> > way wether you were given the correct amount or not. If they say
> > the
> >> > till
> >> >> > balanced they will probably have a paper printout of all the
> >> > transactions
> >> >> > done on the till so you would have a hard job proving otherwise.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Sorry if it sounds harsh, but I think it would be easier to put it
> > down
> >> > to
> >> >> > experience and to start checking your change every time. There is
> > no
> >> >> > reason
> >> >> > to feel distrusting about anything. They would soon shout if you
> >> >> > didn't
> >> >> > pay
> >> >> > them enough, so you should not feel bad about checking they have
> > not
> >> > made
> >> >> > a
> >> >> > mistake, or indeed tried to rip you off.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Regards,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Mark Threadgold.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> >> > From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> >> >> > Behalf
> >> >> > Of
> >> >> > Andy
> >> >> > Sent: 03 June 2008 19:00
> >> >> > To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >> >> > Subject: [access-uk] Trust me with your change
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Hi all.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Here is something to encourage some debate and discussion on the
> > list.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Last Saturday, I was dropped off at a local builders merchant and
> > my
> >> > wife
> >> >> > parked outside while I made a couple of purchases indoors.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I had previously visited the bank and had £60.00, in £20.00 notes
> > in my
> >> >> > pocket.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > My modest purchase was under £5.00 so I should have ended up with 2
> >> > £20.00
> >> >> > notes,, a £10.00 and a £5.00 note and some loose change.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I left the shop and walked the 15 foot across the pavement and got
> > into
> >> >> > the
> >> >> > car, where my wife was waiting on me and to be perfectly frank I
> > did
> >> >> > not
> >> >> > check my change as I'm unable to do this without feeling very
> >> > distrusting.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > An hour or so later, she asked me for some cash and I emptied my
> >> > pockets.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I found 2 £20.00 notes a £5.00 note and some small change.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > We both realised that the shop had not recognized that I had handed
> >> >> > over
> >> > a
> >> >> > £20, mistaking this for a £10 note perhaps.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I agreed to visit the shop today and sort the problem out.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Well,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The man who served me acknowledged that I had indeed given him a
> > £20.00
> >> >> > note
> >> >> >
> >> >> > but insisted that in my change he had given me a £10.00 note, a
> > £5.00
> >> > note
> >> >> > and some change and added that the till was in balance on Saturday
> >> >> > evening.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > So I said to the man that if the missing £10.00 was not in the
> > till,
> >> >> > and
> >> >> > not
> >> >> >
> >> >> > in my pocket, then it must be in his pocket. Again he stated that
> > he
> >> > was
> >> >> > quite sure that he gave me the £10.00 amongst my change.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I asked him of the likelihood of loosing a £10.00 note from a
> > pocket
> >> >> > whilst
> >> >> > not loosing a £5.00 note from the same pocket and he admitted that
> > this
> >> >> > was
> >> >> > very unlikely, though confirmed that he had given me the correct
> >> >> > change.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I left the shop and this matter bugged me all day. There is no way
> >> >> > when
> >> >> > you
> >> >> >
> >> >> > receive a £10.00, a £5.00 and some change and put this in separate
> >> > pockets
> >> >> > that you would loss one note and retain the other . Around 5.00pm
> > I
> >> >> > was
> >> >> > getting very angry and telephoned the shop back and advised them of
> > the
> >> >> > above and told them that I wanted my £10.00 back and a note of
> > apology
> >> > or
> >> >> > I'd be asking my lawyer to contact Consumer Direct tomorrow with a
> >> >> > complaint.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The manager advised that he would telephone me back thirst thing,
> > so
> >> >> > I'm
> >> >> > quite interested to just how they will play this thing out. I'm
> >> >> > absolutely
> >> >> > not interested in receiving £10.00 from their petty chas tin. I
> > need
> >> > some
> >> >> > form of acknowledgement that thy made a mistake.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > So, what do you think guy's.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > All though's uncomfortable moments when you simply push notes and
> > coins
> >> >> > into
> >> >> >
> >> >> > your pocket, feeling that there is something not write but wishing
> >> >> > above
> >> >> > everything to be able to trust the person wheo has just served you.
> >> > Have
> >> >> > I
> >> >> > been doing this all wrong? if so, how do I check my change
> > withough
> >> >> > drawing
> >> >> >
> >> >> > attention to myself and looking like a miser,. a Scottish one at
> > that?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Any observations or ideas would be welcomed.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Best wishes.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Andy
> >> >> >
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> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > __________ NOD32 3155 (20080603) Information __________
> >> >> >
> >> >> > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> >> >> > http://www.eset.com
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
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> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> --
> >> >> No virus found in this incoming message.
> >> >> Checked by AVG.
> >> >> Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.24.6/1482 - Release Date:
> >> > 04/06/2008 07:10
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
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> >> >
> >>
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