I've read and noted all the conversation about these things, and I think it's great of you folks to bring out the good and bad points of the available tools. I myself have what seems to be an effective set of safeguards, and they seem to have been able to keep out all of the intruders. Of course, I still get a few dozen 'garbage' messages a day, and every now and then somebody send some garbage back to me that has my own header on it, stolen and used to disguise their own identity. Why people get their jollies out of being a useless pest still isn't clear to me, but it takes all sorts to make a world. My defense is several layers deep: First my mail comes to me from my ISP, but half or more comes via my institutional address, ieee (Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers), who filter out the viruses and forward to my ISP address. So the first two barriers are the IEEE and my ISP, both sniffing for garbage. What reaches my input is first filtered by the XP firewall, and then by Norton System Works' Anti-Virus and Spybot. Finally, I have my own message-filtering list, which I use discreetly to avoid messages from known pests. All of these work automatically, and all I have to do myself is clean out the 'trash' bin now and then. I particularly enjoyed the recent references to "as bad as Norton" because I have ceased being amused by how difficult it is to get from them a practical way to fix any of their software when it goes bad. I have chewed them out a number of times for selling software which there is absolutely no clean way to uninstall. Or even to correct the error messages that they generate. But the cures they offer are more dangerous and more frustrating than the diseases they have, so I just live with them. And I tell people about them. -- William B. Lurie For a web-based membership management utility and information on list policies, please see http://nibec.com/24hoursupport/ To unsubscribe, send a blank email to 24hoursupport-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with "unsubscribe" (without quotes) in the subject.