[tri-wings] Re: are mails being blocked - WHY??

----- Original Message -----
From: "kay.y"
> Are mails being blocked ?? and if so, why?

Kay, May I AGAIN stress that if you have a problem with the administration of 
this list, or any of the other trisomy lists, that you
write directly to either Sue or myself.

However to answer your questions.
Mails are not being blocked. You may have seen some delay recently from when 
mails were sent and then coming through the list.
However that was because our list host moved servers and I did warn everyone 
some time ago that this was probably going to happen
this weekend. If people actually read the mails, particularly the admin mails, 
they would know what was happening.

There has also been a general slowing down of the net because of the recent 
virus, about which I also posted information to the
list.

Some mails ARE being rejected by the list robot (not Sue and I) because of 
overquoting. However when that happens the list robot
generates a mail back to you telling you that it breaches the quoting rules. 
(which if you weren't aware is 8 lines in one block).
YOU then have a choice to remove the excessive quoting and repost or not. Sue 
and I will not fuss with these mails and repost them
(unless it is someone new etc) because you are all adults and we are not your 
babysitters.

This rule is there out of RESPECT for others, particularly those on the digest 
and those who pay for their mail by the byte. The
same rule also applies across ALL the trisomy lists.

There are some people who are being moderated because of the flaming or flame 
baiting nature of some of their recent mails. Also
simply because their mails do not meet list guidelines. I make
no apology for this as they have clearly been in breach of the list rules or 
recent admin notes.
When a mail is not accepted through moderation we again will not fuss. If you 
want a copy of your mail to go to somebody else then
send it to them. Sue and I are not here to play your secretaries. We DO have 
lives, jobs and families outside of these lists. We are
NOT paid for what we do, but give it freely out of love. Please dont abuse that 
love. (Loving doesn't mean acting like a doormat)

To explain this I will restate the list rules yet again. This is a quote from 
the web site and the list rules admin post that Sue
reposted to the list only a week or so ago.

>>The Trisomy List network has been set up to support families in their walk 
>>through the world of Trisomy.>>

It is NOT a general free for all for people to discuss whatever they feel like. 
Sue and I are on most occassions generous about what
is discussed but that does not mean that it should be taken advantage of.

The Wings list is to discuss the loss of our children and our lives as they are 
effected by trisomy.

General chit chat mails should be taken to the family list as I re-posted only 
last week. However even the family list is not a free
for all. There are rules, if you need to re read those rules then I suggest you 
either e-mail myself or Sue or go to the web site
and read them for your self as Sue reposted them only a week ago.

Respect, tolerance and understanding need to remembered first and foremost. 
Recent discussions which became personal attacks with
name calling and swearing WILL NOT AND NEVER WILL BE TOLERATED UNDER ANY 
CIRCUMSTANCES.

>>how 'we' can sit back and talk about 'our' grief and losses when there is NOW 
>> a state of emergency in the world of evil forces
where young men (and women) ARE GOING TO LOSE THEIR LIVES.>>

Kay I am greatly disturbed by this comment as I know many others are. While I 
agree that it is upsetting that people are being sent
away to possible fight in war where they most certainly will run the risk of 
losing their lives. Our children will also continue to
be born, mothers and fathers will still mourn the loss of the children, their 
hopes and dreams. I still wake up every morning and
must deal with the complications in Alex's life caused by the fact that he is a 
survivor in the trisomy fun park.

Are you saying that we are selfish for grieving for our children? Has Kyles 
life suddenly become unimportant? I am sorry but your
mail reads quite clearly that we should not be upset for our children because 
more important things are happening and I ask you to
take a step back and wonder how you would have felt had that been said to you 
when you first lost Kyle.

I have spent this whole weekend attending a conference regarding current 
research into chromosome 18, the latest cytogenetic
techniques, the applicability of gene therapy etc. Supporting families who have 
lost children with Chromosome 18 disorders and those
with surviving children. I am sorry Kay, I didn't realise that this was no 
longer important and that I should have just stayed at
home and worried about what MAY happen in a war against terrorism. That would 
have solved everything?? Is this war going to mean
that trisomy and other chromosome anomalies will just cease to exist because 
they are no longer important??

I am sorry Kay, but on behalf of the almost 200 families on this list I am 
offended and deeply hurt by this comment. And I make no
apology for being sarcastic and cruel because I find this comment by you to be 
VERY hurtful especially after all the support that
you have been shown in your time of need.

I grieve yes. I worry yes. But I also need to get on with life and not fall 
apart like a drama queen. A very significant person in
my life for over 20 years is an officer in the army. He is only 6 months back 
from yet another war (which I didn't see anyone
commenting about on the lists - in fact how many people are even aware that 
Australian soldiers have been "in action" recently with
some of our closest neighbours?) where people DID lose their lives. And he has 
already been sent off again. So yes it does directly
effect me Kay, perhaps more so than yourself for I too have a son in law 
(actually two) who will get called up and it will hurt as
my daughter already has a small 2 year old and is currently pregnant. I will 
also have the additional worry of obtaining medicines,
services etc for my child with a trisomy diagnosis in a world that will have a 
shortage of these things.

> Freedom of speech should surely be extended to this list (I am NOT 
> criticising the people that administrate ANY parts of this
list), but it is unrealistic to expect people not tohave feelings and not to 
hve an opinion.

I do expect people to have feelings and opinions Kay. However I also expect 
them to act like adults and to take debate regarding
those feelings and opinions to the appropriate place - which is NOT this list.
I am also curious as to what you mean by freedom of speech? What is freedom of 
speech? The ability to say whatever you like,
whenever you like, wherever you like without fear of retribution?

This list is not a democracy and never has been. It is not for list members to 
decide what will be discussed. It is a beneovelant
matriarchy. Benevolent because Sue and I do listen to what people want where we 
can, however a matriarchy because the ultimate
decision rests with us.

As a result it is a list with RULES and we expect those rules to be listened to 
and adhered to. If you dont like them you have been
invited many times to write to us OFF LIST and discuss it. However Kay you 
certainly seem to express your right to freedom of speech
by continually ignoring these list rules, admin notes and polite requests to 
discuss admin issues privately. You are also the first
to get upset and complain if somebody else posts to the list, exercising their 
right to freedom of speech as you put it and it
upsets your way of thinking. Or indeed if people don't post to the list when 
they feel they should. That is not freedom of speech.

That is why we have list rules and why part of those list rules dictates what 
is discussed and how it is discussed.

If you don't agree with this Kay then I invite you to start a list of your own 
where people can talk about whatever they want,
however they want. This list remains to discuss Trisomy and the loss of our 
children who have died from trisomy and related issues.
I respect what is happening in this world Kay but I do still see that our 
children, and the loss of our children is still very
important. This list has not changed and will continue to provide a forum for 
people to discuss this. People are free to express
their feelings regarding the declaration of war and to receive support - 
HOWEVER debate IS NOT permitted. People who continually
post messages that encourage or invite debate will be MODERATED. People who 
continue to ignore the list rules will be moderated and
or removed from the list.

If you look up, there are no limits.
-- Japanese Proverb

Keep Looking for Rainbows!!!
Karen, Mum to Alex (6, T-18 mosaic)
Sydney, Australia
http://members.optushome.com.au/karens
http://www.trisomyonline.org


                  Building ___ooOOoo__ Rainbows
                       www.trisomyonline.org
                  Families Helping Families On-line

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