[tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

  • From: "Charles Atkins" <catkins@xxxxxxx>
  • To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 15:03:15 -0400

Ofcourse you can!

----- Original Message ----- From: "Mister Blackjack" <misterblackjack2@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 2:06 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Google it? Google what? Have no name for the law. What suppose to Google for
every federal mass transit law? Don't think so.


-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Easy Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 2:01 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Just google it.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mister Blackjack" <misterblackjack2@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 1:50 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Hi, I think why federal law as you say requires that they not go more than
3/4 miles off route is this is fine in a big city like New York or even
Jacksonville or Miami or LA and so on. Most of the people don't live out
3/4 miles off the route if that. Plus in them size cities they have other
type of mass transit. This Federal law did not take in account rural
I have not read the law or seen it. So I am just going on what is being
here. Is I stated before you all are still forgetting about the ADA law
which is Federal law as well. Which one would take president here would
than likely have to be sorted out in court. Just my thoughts and now would
like to read this law if you all have a link to where it is at?


-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Of Easy Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 1:03 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Hi Lorie,

Thanks for the info but I am a little skeptical in the fact that Dial A
does more than federal law requires. The only thing they can do is extent
the 3 fourths of a mile rule and I know for a fact that is not the case.
Nancy folsom had to walk a block or 2 to catch Dial A ride when she lived
Montrose and people need to remember talk is cheep and government will
you anything to get you off there back.  Before I would believe this, I
would want it in writing from the city as policy that will never be
We are currently under budget cuts and most likely it will get worse.  If
does that extra that dial a ride is supposedly giving will be the first to
go simply because federal law doesn't require it.  I think there are also
other people on this list that will tell you that dial a ride won't pick
them up because they are out side the 3 fourth mile requirement so I would
ask what they do that goes beyond federal requirements.


----- Original Message ----- From: Laurie Davis <mailto:davisllb@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 12:31 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Hi all,

As some of you may know, my husband, Kevin, is on the Transportation
Advisory Committee for the Mayor.  This committee advises the City
Commission on transportation issues with Star Metro.  Mr. Sheib is on the
Committee, as well as some other people in the community. I forwarded the
questions that Sila posted yesterday.  He posted some of the questions to
the Committee.  One had to do with making the street crossings at the
transfer points safer.  The other had to do with making textual maps of
routes, similar to those books that Taltran had.  He thought they should
have carefully-worded descriptions of the routes and the stops, including
landmarks, such as office buildings and shopping centers.
From what he can find out so far, Dial-A-Ride will not be changed at
all, since they already do a lot more than the federal requirements for
paratransit service.

I hope this helps.


----- Original Message ----- From: Sila Miller <mailto:silam@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 8:35 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Lynn, This is absolutely excellent and I truly appreciate
your time, effort and spokesmenship!
The below info came from a sighted but non-driving friend
who takes the bus DAILY to the R.A. Gray building, and for virtually all
errands.  She saw these weaknesses with the map as published on the
Have a look and use what you need. I too liked Robert's suggestion of
routes (smaller buses.)
Thank you again!

1.  No bus access on Ocala Road between Tharpe and Tennessee
2.  No bus access to schools on Miccosukee Road (Leon High,
Catholic, Cobb Middle and Kate Sullivan)
3.  No bus going into either Tallahassee Mall or Governor's
Square Mall
4.  No bus to Griffin Middle School or Ruediger Elementary
5.  No bus on South Bronough Street between Pensacola Street
and Gaines
- access to R.A. Gray Building
6.  No bus on West College Avenue
7.  No bus on Governor's Square Boulevard
8.  No bus access to Lincoln High, Apalachee Elementary or
9.  No bus to Trousdell Gymnastics Center and pool

----- Original Message ----- From: Lynn Evans <mailto:evans-lynn@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 3:54 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Ok how does this sound.

I will definitely begoing to one of the meetings at
the senior center and maybe more on the 21st and 28.

I have made a folder and I will funnel your concerns
about the Nova 2010 Plan into this folder and print the items out to take
the meeting. I am starting with Robert's message. I will remove the names
protect the innocent.

Now if someone thinks this is a bad idea or just
wants to sound off and not have it printed out then I want do it.

----- Original Message ----- From: Easy Talk
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, September 18, 2009 9:15 AM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

This new system will pretty much make most
of us home bound since federal law says Pari Transit only has to go 3
quarters of a mile out of the fixed route system and from what I can tell
and is clearly stated in the plan busses will no longer go in to neighbor
hoods.  You can run buses up and down major roads in Tallahassee all you
want but it looks like they will be empty since people can't get to them.

If it rains, the city might as well shut
down the buses.  Not many people are going to walk a mile or 2 to catch
bus and dial a ride will no longer be required to pick you up.

----- Original Message -----
From: Chip Orange
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009
5:53 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: Nova 2010 Plan

Hi William and all,

thank you for the posting.

I'd like you to know I've been
speaking with another blind individual, who is neither associated with
or TCB, so most of us are unlikely to know what he knows and vice versa.

He in turn has been speaking with
Sam, and has mentioned to him that the new routes as planned, do not go
directly up to the malls (such as Governor's Square), but only approach a
near-by street corner (I believe he said the Parkway and Park Avenue for

This would mean quite a walk for
someone going to Gov Square, and even worse, part of it would have to be
across the parking lot without any landmarks.

He has also mentioned that several
routes would require transferring by walking across a difficult to cross
street such as ThomasVille Road or Capitol Circle, in order to achieve
certain routings.

In general, he believes Star Metro
has made these decisions without considering the difficulty a blind
pedestrian would face in following the plan.

I don't know if his understanding is
correct, and even if the current plan is still this way, but I thought I'd
point it out for those who are interested as an item I would judge to be




Chip Orange
Database Administrator
Florida Public Service Commission

(850) 413-6314

(Any opinions expressed are solely
those of the author and do not necessarily reflect those of the Florida
Public Service Commission.)


tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of
Sent: Thursday, September
17, 2009 5:40 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Nova 2010


The following is an on going
discussion I have been having with Sam Scheiv of Star Metro.   In fact
is his first message, back to me.

Dear Mr. Benjamin:

It was nice speaking to you
yesterday.  Please find attached the document describing the Nova 2010
project.  Below I have written descriptions of each route

as they are now.  I have not
included every turn or small street, but enough to understand the general
direction.  These routes are still in flux.  In

fact I just made a change
this morning.  So this is not final.  We are taking suggestions from the
public and incorporating them into the plan.  That means

we need to know what people
DO like as much as what people don't like.  I hope you find this
and I appreciate you calling.


Samuel L. Scheib

Senior Planner

Nova 2010 Overview

For many years transit
concentrated in downtown Tallahassee where shoppers, moviegoers,
and diners invariably traveled.  Over the ensuing decades, the downtown
share of the city's employment decreased as shopping centers, restaurants,
movie theaters, and even government jobs relocated to the periphery (Tax
World, Koger Center, CCOC, etc.).

The practice of transit is
changing, and a growing number of agencies have found serving multiple
destinations has been tremendously successful, starting with West Coast
transit properties in Portland, Oregon, and San Diego, California and then
spreading to places like Colorado Springs and Madison, Wisconsin, a state
capital with a large university presence like our own.  In Florida,
and Broward Counties have similarly restructured their systems.

Concurrent with the 2005
StarMetro Renaissance Plan, the 2005 Transit Development Plan, the
2008 City Commission Target Issue Meeting and the City Manager's 2009
Resolutions, StarMetro has taken preliminary steps to create a
route structure plan for the City of Tallahassee.  Once implemented, the
plan, known as Nova 2010, would distribute transit services mostly along
major roadways in Tallahassee; several routes will not serve downtown at
all.  By not sending every route to C.K. Steele Plaza, passengers would
experience greater frequency of service and a system that more closely
resembles contemporary vehicular travel patterns.

In developing the draft
plan, there were several assumptions about conditions in Tallahassee.
First, the system would, like the present one, serve the city of
with the few exceptions currently in place, such as Bradfordville on the
80x.  Second, we would work to use, to the best extent possible, existing
facilities.  We have Steele Plaza and approximately 105 bus shelters, and
have adapted a draft plan to use these resources as a starting point on
implementation day.   Expanding with additional facilities would be added
the plan gains popularity, as needed and as fiscally feasible. Lastly, we
assumed two lanes on Tennessee Street between Monroe and Ocala would be
converted to transit-only use, as is currently recommended in a study by
Genesis Group.  Beyond that, our goal was to use similar existing
resources-the number of buses and drivers, the funding level-all would
remain as close as possible to current levels.  The above is based on our
cursory draft plan. This draft plan is subject to changes based minimally
on a full system analysis, review of alternatives, considerable public
involvement, a thorough origin and destination study and Commission

We focused our analysis on
employment density, as the planning literature consistently points to
employment density being better at generating transit trips than
density; although having high densities of both is best. Since employment densities are highest on major roadways, we assigned routes to these roads
while trying to approximate a grid network as seen on the attached map.

Nova 2010 is intended to
accomplish several things:

q       Reduce Downtown
Trips: The most common customer complaint is that all the buses go
At a recent listening session, a customer lamented the only way to get
one section of Orange Avenue to another was to first go to Steele Plaza at the corner of Tennessee and Adams Streets. In order to mimic contemporary travel patters (i.e. to go to jobs on the periphery) passengers often must
make the V-shaped trip of going downtown first and then back out again to
the customers final destination.

q       Reduce Redundancy:
The current hub and spoke system requires all buses to meet at the same
at the central hub. Since C.K. Steele Plaza is located along a major
arterial (W. Tennessee Street, near the intersection with Monroe Street),
every bus must travel along this corridor at the same time in order for
passengers to make their transfers. This results in two or more buses
arriving and leaving from the plaza in tandem to travel along the same
corridor for a significant distance, passing the same stops. With the
concept Nova 2010 plan, the importance of C.K. Steele Plaza is downplayed
buses operate independent of each other. This allows for one bus to cover
entire corridor, instead of five buses covering the same corridor, as is
case of W. Tennessee Street.

q       Increase On-Time
Performance: Another complaint staff receives is buses run behind
This is primarily due to two reasons - buses traveling at lower speeds in
neighborhoods, and routes being dependent on each other for transfers
if one arrives late, the other buses are held for transferring patrons).
Under Nova 2010, buses will remain on the major roads allowing for higher
travel speeds as  applicable. In addition, the routes operate independent
each other. This means if one arrives late, it does not affect the
of the other routes. Patrons are would be accommodated better with Nova
with higher service frequency leading to shorter wait times (10 to 30
minutes during peak hours verses up to an hour with the current system).

q       Increased
Ridership/Decreased Carbon Footprint: StarMetro expects Nova 2010 to make
transit significantly more attractive to a much broader part of the
community, and each single-occupancy-vehicle driver that shifts to transit represents reduced carbon emissions, cleaner air, reduced congestion, less
road maintenance, etc.

q       Reduce travel time
for patrons using transit: Instead of going in and out of neighborhoods,
Nova 2010 plan would have more direct service to major employment and
shopping/recreation centers.

q       Increase frequency:
Buses will arrive more often giving our customers more options for using
transit service with greater convenience.

q       Increased
Opportunities for Regional Travel: With few exceptions (80X, Route 17, and
Route 21), there are no opportunities for regional travel in the current
system. By decentralizing the system, independent cross-town routes along
major corridors create the opportunities for regional expansion.

While there are many
distinct advantages in addition to the aforementioned ones of the Nova
concept plan, there are a few perceived disadvantages, which have proven
be advantages across the country:

q       Routes would no
longer circulate within neighborhoods. This will, however, allow StarMetro
to serve a larger population by providing higher frequency and better
service to the most popular destinations.

q       Related to the
above, walking distances to StarStops are anticipated to increase. On the
other hand, this will lead to fewer stops, increased mobility, a more
pleasurable riding experience and a healthier community.

The benefits, however, would
far outweigh the few discrete disadvantages, which are better communicated
in a longer visual presentation.  StarMetro would have a more dependable
system going where our patrons want to go doing so in a timely, efficient

After I got this message, as
per Sila requested, I asked for a discription of the routes for the eleven
bus routes, and they are as follows..

US 90 (1), 20 minutes:
Fallschase, W US 90, S Appleyard, W Pensacola, N Blountstown, E US 90

US 90 (2), 20 minutes:
Fallschase, W US 90, N Capital Circle, loop through Commonwealth, S
Circle, E US 90

Orange, 15 minutes:  Loop
through Paul Dirac, W Roberts, S Eisenhower, E Lake Jackson/Orange Ave, S
Capital Circle, loop through Capital Circle Office Center

East, 15 minutes.  Village
Square, Capital Circle, Southwood/Capital Circle Office Center

Southside, 15 minutes: Ross
Road, N Shelfer, N Crawfordville, Gaile Ave, N Monroe Street, Steele Plaza

Frenchtown/Bond, 15 minutes:
Orange, Saxon, Wahnish/Macomb/Old Bainbridge, Volusia, Alabama to Preston
Loop, and back.

Pensalachee, 20 minutes:
Pensacola, Gaines, Lafayette, Apalachee Parkway

Hospitals, 30 minutes:
Woodland, Tuscan, Sunnyside, N. Ridge, E Springsax, E Bragg, E Paul Dirac,

Jim Lee, N Magnolia, E Miccosukee, Capital Medical,

Bufford, NE Centerville, SE
Fleischmann, W Misscosukee

West Loop, 30 minutes (both
directions): N Monroe, SW Fred George, S Mission, S Appleyard, E Jackson
Bluff, N Woodward, E St. Augustine, through downtown

to Monroe

NE to Innovation:  N
Pottsdamer, E Iamonia, N Lake Jackson, E Gaines, Gadsden, Thomasville

North Mover, 30 minutes:
Commonwealth, Hartsfield, Pullen, Allen, Henderson, Meridian,

CommonWalmart, 30 minutes:
Commonwealth, Tharpe, MLK/Duval/Bronough, Park, Gov. Square Blvd, Park
Conner Blvd, Walmart.

It has been that
discriptions brings up more questions than answere, so here it is to work

William benjamin

William Benjamin, Piano
Tuner Extraordinaire.
The tuner alone preserves
the tone.


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