=20 > Can you please guide me in performing post layout timing analysis. >How to calculate hold time, setup time , setup margin, hold margin = from the simulated=20 >wave form. (what is the formulas used). =20 =20 Dear Si-List Members: First, I would like to wish all of you a great Holiday season! Indeed, timing computation are quite important. SI analyses = frequently involve evaluation of both signal quality and timing margins. However, signal quality degradations can be=20 tolerated in many cases provided they do not cause timing violations. Timing analyses of a high-speed net usually requires taking into consideration driver and receiver chips timing specifications. These IC specs are of two types: (1) timing requirements, and (2) guaranteed responses. Among timing requirements (constraints) are setup time, hold time, and pulse width. A typical guaranteed response is chip's = propagation delay. Constraints normally have either a maximum or minimum (but not = both) unlike delays which almost always contain both minimum and maximum = values. One of my previous postings on the si-list, (subject: Common Clock and Source Synchronous=20 Timing Margins; Date: January 20, 2002) contains several references, a listing of timing parameters plus formulas for setup and hold margins. The driver/receiver ICs Technology, the bus Topology (plus loading), = and Termination can significantly impact timing. For a high-speed bus, the clock skew and jitter may noticeably influence the effective clock = period and timing margins. It is useful to note that some of the parameters required for timing margins are obtainable from manufacturer data sheets, while other = parameters need to be ascertained via simulations (post-route or pre-route). For instance, the minimum and=20 maximum flight times are extracted by means of simulations while driver = Tco, receiver Tsetup, Thold from devices' data sheets. Timing specs furnished by manufacturers data sheets are based on test = loads which=20 usually differ from system interconnect loading. Consequently, the = flight time values resulting from system simulations need certain adjustments before they can be accurately applied in computation of timing margins. Timing diagrams which label the times between signal transitions/edges provide a popular means=20 to clarify timing specifications. Timing equations can be derived from timing diagrams and then summarized in a spreadsheet (such as Excel) or a table. An article = entitled "DDR2 Design Guide For Two-DIMM Systems" (TN-47-01 available on Micron = Web Site) presents several examples of=20 timing budgets in table format. That paper also discusses concept of "derating"; heavy system loading can lead to derating of setup and hold times (given by data sheets) depending on slew rates. Based on timing relationships between a data signal and a clock, one = way to enhace setup margin is to shorten the data trace length (or increase clock trace length) at = the price of lowering the hold margin. Conversely, hold margin can be improved by lengthening = the data line or shortening clock trace (but at expense of setup margin). An alternative way to increase setup margin is by incresing the clock period (lowering operation frequency) and this will = not affect hold margin. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year! Abe Riazi ServerWorks =20 ------------------------------------------------------------------ To unsubscribe from si-list: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field or to administer your membership from a web page, go to: //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list For help: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field List FAQ wiki page is located at: http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ List technical documents are available at: http://www.si-list.org List archives are viewable at: //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list or at our remote archives: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at: http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu