[SI-LIST] Re: Right Angle Bends / MECL Handbook

  • From: "Lee Ritchey" <leeritchey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "Stefan Milnor" <stefan.milnor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, "Michael Greim" <mgreim001@xxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2011 13:07:24 -0700

There must be more than one version of the paper copies as I read the page 
number right off my copy!

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Stefan Milnor" <stefan.milnor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 11:14 AM
To: "Michael Greim" <mgreim001@xxxxxxxxx>
Cc: "Lee Ritchey" <leeritchey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; "Scott McMorrow" 
<scott@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; "Julian Ferry" <julian.ferry@xxxxxxxxxx>; 
<si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [SI-LIST] Right Angle Bends / MECL Handbook

> Michael -
>
>
> Yes, this is the book I meant. Thank you for pointing out the on-line
> PDF copy. Now I don't have to worry about losing my paper copy. I got my
> paper copy back in the days before the web, when you had to be nice to
> sales people if you wanted to get any data sheets and application notes.
>
>
>
> And, although I did not realize it when I referenced the MECL handbook
> this morning, it appears to be the source of the Right Angle Bend
> debate, as pointed out by Mr. Lee Ritchy. However, the page referenced
> by Lee is wrong - the right angle bend discussion is on (paper copy)
> pages 143 and 144 (and, in the PDF version, these are PDF pages 154 and
> 155).
>
>
>
> I don't know who is right on this. Perhaps this part of the MECL book is
> flawed, but overall I think this book is a great free resource, with
> clear arguments backed by measurements and figures.
>
>
>
> And I don't think any of you debating this the last few days got any
> work done J
>
>
>
> -          Stefan
>
>
>
> From: Michael Greim [mailto:mgreim001@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 8:47 AM
> To: Stefan Milnor
> Cc: Lee Ritchey; Scott McMorrow; Julian Ferry; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Re: Right Angle Bends
>
>
>
> Stefan,
>
>
>
> Did you mean the MECL System Design Handbook?
>
>
>
> http://s.eeweb.com/pl/1276642244-MECL-system-design-handbook.pdf
>
>
>
> If you are old school and want to do some highlighting you
>
> can also find this on amazon with the classic cover starting
>
> at  0.88.
>
>
>
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0006YFW7G/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF
> 8&condition=used
>
>
>
> Job Bob says check it on out.......
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Michael C. Greim
>
> And all this science they don't understand
> Is just my job six days a week.....
>
> We will either find a way or make one   -Hannibal
>
> In the middle of every difficulty lies opportunity   -Al Einstein
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jul 16, 2011 at 11:29 AM, Stefan Milnor
> <stefan.milnor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> There were plenty of signal integrity issues in the days of DIPs and
> wire wrap. The structures were just bigger. One of my favorite signal
> integrity references is the Motorola ECL (Emitter Coupled Logic)
> Handbook, long out - of -print. It is amazing what they did in the '60s
> with high speed ECL wire-wrap constructions. And everything that you
> have been debating can be analyzed and explained with a set of equations
> developed in 1862 .....
>
> - Stefan
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
>
> On Behalf Of Michael Greim
> Sent: Saturday, July 16, 2011 5:13 AM
> To: Lee Ritchey
> Cc: Scott McMorrow; Julian Ferry; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Right Angle Bends
>
> Regarding "myths" and SI, Folks look everywhere and believe
> what they "think" is there, and other folks may very well go, yup
> it's there.  However, they only really "see", when the light is good.
> After all, if someone posted something on the SI list, then by
> definition
> it has to be true because only "the experts" on any given topic post
> there.
> Unless of course, they are a manager.........;-)  or mangler as some
> may view it, on items of a technical nature.......8-P......when the
> light is good.......8-O.
>
> Everyone knows that if you can't see it then it is not there, much like
> the emperors new clothes.  Lab correlation and validation will verify
> the lack of clothing.  Ya myt could sim this as well.
>
> In the days of DIPs there was no need for any signal or power integrity
> and a twisted pair was merely two wire wrap wires put into a drill and
> the trigger being pulled, and wirewrap established the ideal spiral
> serpentining for signal transmission.
>
> That is all............
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Michael C. Greim
>
> And all this science they don't understand
> Is just my job six days a week.....
>
> We will either find a way or make one   -Hannibal
>
> In the middle of every difficulty lies opportunity   -Al Einstein
>
> On Fri, Jul 15, 2011 at 6:47 PM, Lee Ritchey
> <leeritchey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>wrote:
>
>> It is odd that those who fret over right angle bends seem to ignore
> the
>> fact
>> that there is at least on at every via where a trace connects.  My old
>> friend, Dan Murphy, called this "looking where the light is good."
>>
>> The same engineers used dual in line IC packages by the millions with
> as
>> many as three right angle bends in each lead.  They weren't visible,
> so
>> they
>> didn't count!
>>
>> --
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
>
> or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>
> For help:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
>
>
> List technical documents are available at:
>               http://www.si-list.net <http://www.si-list.net/>
>
> List archives are viewable at:
>               //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
>
> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
>               http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -- 
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
>
> or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>
> For help:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
>
>
> List technical documents are available at:
>                http://www.si-list.net
>
> List archives are viewable at:
> //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
>
> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
>  http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>
> 
------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe from si-list:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field

or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list

For help:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field


List technical documents are available at:
                http://www.si-list.net

List archives are viewable at:     
                //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
 
Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
                http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
  

Other related posts: