[SI-LIST] Re: Hspice 2D Field Solver Vs. XFX

Yes, for microstrip and stripline traces I have seen substantial
discrepancies between losses predicted by:
* Hpsice internal field solver
* XFX -> Hspice
* ADS
* Ansoft Q2D -> Hspice

The results vary depending on topology (microstrip, symmetric stripline,
asymmetric stripline), frequency (conductor vs. dielectric loss), and
whether an ideal conductor was used for the ground plane(s) (with Ansoft
Q2D I got MORE loss using an ideal conductor!?!?).  Of course, there are
TONS of ways of making subtle errors, and assumptions can easily be
wrong.  So, I'd strongly suggest only trusting a 2D solver (or 3D, for
that matter) when you've got some good correlation to measurements, and
that correlation only applies to similar structures. Regardless of the
simulator's capabilities, it's too easy to introduce errors to trust the
results blindly.

In my experience, ADS correlated the best overall, with XFX -> Hspice a
close second.

I don't have an explanation for the discrepancies. It's always possible
I had something set wrong that produced the errors, but I don't think
so.=20

Disclaimer:
The content of this message is my personal opinion only and although I
am an employee of Intel, the statements I make here in no way represent
Intel's position on the issue, nor am I authorized to speak on behalf of
Intel on this matter.=20

Jeff Loyer

-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Guasti Giovanni
Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 12:20 AM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Hspice 2D Field Solver Vs. XFX

Please ignore the previous message and the terrible English!

Sorry for the cryptic Object!
I tried some simulations using W element lines.
In the first case the RLGC matrix was generated by the internal Hspice =
=3D
2D EM simulator, in the second case the RLGC matrix was generated by =3D
XFX.
Losses in case one are larger than in case two. Materials and geometry =
=3D
are the same, as well ro and tan.
My questions:
1) did you noticed the same behaviour? is it always true, I mean for all
=3D geometries?
2) why?
3) who is right? (Hspice EM simulator seems more similar to measures)
Best regards, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year
        Giovanni
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