[SI-LIST] Re: HSDD: Re: SI Position Open READ THIS!!!!
- From: "Harvey, Wilbur" <Wilbur.Harvey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: francis.kai@xxxxxxxxx,"'freeman@xxxxxxxxxxx'" <freeman@xxxxxxxxxxx>,Howard Johnson <howiej@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2002 12:21:00 -1000
I disagree with this.
Most engineers do not have advanced degrees.
Signal integrity and timing issues are required for basic design in today's
world, the same way that ohms law was (still is) required in earlier times.
A college graduate should know all the basics, which today includes signal
integrity.
Most EE design tasks today are more dependent on signal integrity than wave
theory, VLSI circuit design or solid state theory.
Wilbur Harvey - Engineer
Adtech Inc., www.adtech-inc.com
3465 Waialae Ave. Suite 200
Honolulu, HI 96816
Tel: +1 (808) 440 3363, Fax: +1 (808) 440 3494
email: wilbur.harvey@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: Kai, Francis [mailto:francis.kai@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 11:58 AM
To: 'freeman@xxxxxxxxxxx'; Howard Johnson
Cc: ventham@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; owsley@xxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: HSDD: Re: SI Position Open READ THIS!!!!
Dear SI gurus:
Although all of you are great experts on SI and EMI, please allow me
to say one word or two since I had been a student and an Assistant
Professor in Electrical and Computer Engineering.
I think the undergraduate education should be based on fundamentals
and the graduate education should be focused on a special field. I do not
think we need to teach "signal integrity" or "EMI" in undergraduate studies.
Basic circuit theory, electronics (digital and analog circuit design), solid
state devices, electromagnetics and electromagnetic waves theory, and VLSI
circuit design are the key courses. If the instructor (professor or
lecturer)
can pass these concepts clearly to the students in the above fields, then we
will have good engineers. You don't need to know how to calculate skews,
crosstalks, PEECs, and other SI concepts in undergraduate studies because
if you have excellent background in circuit theory, EM&EMW, you can easily
pick up these concepts.
Regards,
Francis Kai
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Freeman [mailto:freeman@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2002 11:08 AM
To: Howard Johnson
Cc: ventham@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; owsley@xxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: HSDD: Re: SI Position Open READ THIS!!!!
Dear Howard,
The situation at Rice is not unlike the situation at Purdue while I
was attending. When I started as a freshman engineering student, the
requirement for graduation was for 141 semester hours of education.
Before I could graduate, the pressure of open universities, drop in
engineering education( it was deemed by most undergraduates as too hard.
Also, the layoffs in 1969 due to the implosion of the aerospace industry
and the visual in the newspaper of a Phd. in Aeronautical engineering
sweeping the floor of a gas station as a part-time attendant as a
reminder of the corporate rewards for such hard work), and the general
attitude in the U.S. that we needed the war on poverty and the vietnam
war at the same time caused Purdue to streamline the education and
reduce the number of hours required to 120 hours. This was done at the
expense of the engineering courses and not the required humanities. I am
all for both(I amassed 157 semester hours in the 8 semesters and a
summer session that I attended) but to weaken the programs was probably
a mistake.
Thanks
Jim Freeman
Howard Johnson wrote:
> Dear Jim Freeman,
>
> I agree with you whole-heartedly that EE education is being shunted
> aside
> in favor of computer science at many universities. It's unfortunately,
> really, that
> educators have to make such decisions, but understandable of course.
> Out of
> the torrent of papers, conferences, and new information available each
> year they
> have to choose what is worthy of presentation to new students, and
> what has become
> "passe" or is available otherwise as "on-the-job" training. For
> example, at my
> alma matter Rice University I've heard rumors that the EE curriculum
> may soon be
> dropped or scaled back. From my perspective, eliminating subjects like
> transmission
> lines, electromagnetic fields, (low voltage) power distribution and
> interconnect
> modeling would be a mistake, but then I don't get to make such
> decisions (and I'm
> glad I don't have to).
>
> Clayton Paul has done a lot to popularize the teaching of EMC
> in colleges and universities with his textbook "Introduction to
> Electromagnetic
> Compatibility" and his persistent efforts within the IEEE to discuss
> EE
> curriculum. At this point I'm wondering who will step forward to do
> the same job
> for the field of signal integrity.
>
> Best regards,
> Dr. Howard Johnson, Signal Consulting Inc.,
> tel 509-997-0505, howiej@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> http:\\signalintegrity.com -- High-Speed Digital Design articles,
> books, tools, and seminars
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Jim Freeman
> Sent: Monday, January 28, 2002 2:17 PM
> To: ventham@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Cc: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; owsley@xxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: SI Position Open READ THIS!!!!
>
>
> Hi All,
> Howard's article compares vintage with EMC. As one of the vintage
> engineers,
> I think the problem is really in the conversion from an emphasis on
> the
> ELECTRICAL in E.E. to an emphasis on computers in electrical
> engineering. Most
> engineers who graduate today think of electrons as an anachronism, if
> they think
> of them at all.
> As us vintage engineers remember, we were educated when the
> transition was
> occurring from motors, relays and tubes to a solid-state emphasis. We
> have
> performed our engineering job so well that those who practice
> engineering today
> don't worry about solid-state. it just works. We are generally in the
> same boat
> with today's engineers in regard to motor theory because it was being
> de-emphasized in our education.
>
> Thanks
> Jim Freeman
>
> Mike Ventham wrote:
>
> > Greetings All,
> >
> > I think Howard has now recognized vintage as being related to bald.
> >
> > See "NOT ALL EMC ENGINEERS ARE BALD"
> > Don't believe every myth you hear.
> > http://article.EDNMag.com/UM/T.ASP?A5.12.1729.9.1940859194
> >
> > At 02:28 19/06/01, Bill Owsley wrote:
> >
> > >At 11:45 PM 06/18/2001 +0100, Mike Ventham wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > >The same seems to go for EMC engineers. I have met many who are
> 'old'
> > >
> > >the politically correct now use 'vintage' instead of 'old' - like
> in wine...
> > >;>
> > >
> > > >analog engineers!
> > > >
> > > >At 23:19 18/06/01, you wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >i kinda get the feeling that its the other way around... a
> true SI
> > > guy is a
> > > > >
> > > > >microwave guy who's turned digital. ;-) all the digital guys
> that
> > > pick up
> > > > >on a little microwave are just SI wannabe's.
> > > > >
> > > > >miker
> > > > >
> > > > >p.s. i'm a digital guy and the above is said tongue-in-cheek.
> > > > >
> > > > >(snipped for bandwidth)
> > >
> > >----------------------------
> > >Bill Owsley, owsley@xxxxxxxxx
> > >919) 392-8341
> > >
> > >Compliance Engineer
> > >Cisco Systems
> > >
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Mike
> > ________________________________________________________________
> > | Mike Ventham - Vice-President Engineering, |
> > | Quantic EMC Inc. Headquarters |
> > | Croft House, Chilcompton, 191 Lombard Ave., Winnipeg,|
> > | Somerset, UK, BA3 4JA Manitoba, Canada R3B 0X1 |
> > | Tel: 44 (0)1761 232191 Tel: (204) 942 4000 |
> > | Fax: 44 (0)7974 141685 Fax: (204) 957 1158 |
> > | Mobile: 44 (0)7971 553260 |
> > | Email: ventham@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx http://www.quantic-emc.com |
> >
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