[sac-forum] Re: Waiver-amendment debate.....

  • From: Jeff Hopkins <phxjeff@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: sac-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2005 09:18:05 -0700

Looking at what other clubs are doing may not be a good criteria. Just because someone else does something does not make it right, good or something you should do too. Indeed other clubs that use waivers may be looking at SAC and asking "why do we need waivers when SAC has had no problems and does not use them?"

I feel it is a fallacy to assume a waiver offers any protection, club or individual.

I feel this a great injustice to the board and general members. If the club or a member is truly negligent and someone sues, the club or member(s) will not be protected by a waiver. It is possible, as pointed out by someone else, that in a situation like that any award maybe increased because of the waiver as it may be seen as trying to hide something and avoid responsibility and thus allow an unsafe condition to exist.

My feeling is waivers will not offer any protection and will cause many problems. I also feel the board has not adequately evaluated the problems involved with waivers.

The best way to protect the club is by making sure events are safe. A written safety policy and proof of adhering to the policy would be the best defense incase of litigation. The next level is incorporation. For a long time I thought the club was incorporated and was shocked when I found it was not. Lastly, having accident insurance to cover costs of any injury should be the final step for a responsible club.

Jeff

At 08:45 -0700 8/25/05, Bob Christ wrote:
Regarding the waiver issue, resistance to change is a human trait more pervasive than acceptance of change. Need a proof point? Judo couldn't exist without resistance to change - rather it counts on it. And, resistance can be most pervasive when one's "rights" appear to be impacted. On the flip side, the proposed waiver "protects" the rights of others. It's difficult-to-near-impossible to "have it both ways."


Unless the proposed waiver is breaking new ground amongst astronomy clubs (doubtful), other fellow clubs have already passed this way. It would be helpful to example how they manage their club's indemnity. I view this as a business issue, versus a personal issue. The club agreed to formalize its business structure and members must assume the appropriate responsibility to achieve that end.

My thoughts.

Respectfully,

Bob Christ


-- Jeff Hopkins HPO SOFT Hopkins Phoenix Observatory http://www.hposoft.com/Astro/astro.html

                     Hopkins Phoenix Observatory
                       7812 West Clayton Drive
                   Phoenix, Arizona 85033-2439 U.S.A.
                        www.hposoft.com

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