[rollei_list] Re: OT Ancient Computers (was Re: Re: Rollei -Singapore) now analogue versus digital

Great post Frank!  Real radios glow in the dark.     
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: Frank Dernie <Frank.Dernie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 15:38:37 
To: <rollei_list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [rollei_list] Re: OT Ancient Computers (was Re: Re: Rollei -Singapore) 
now analogue versus digital


The fact that several (no more) prominent people still use film is not  
evidence that it is better.
In all practical ways digital has exceeded the capability of film for  
some time. Certainly if there is an effect which one wishes to  
achieve, using a vintage LF lens for example, film may have to be the  
choice but that does not make film better, just an appropriate choice  
in some circumstances.
Analogue sound is the same. The fact that some people prefer the sound  
of analogue is not evidence that it is better (I am one by the way)  
but that it matches their taste in sound. My Mum likes her old valve  
(tube) radio - "lovely tone" and it does sound nice, but there are no  
high frequencies at all, along the same lines as LPs in real world  
systems but more extreme.
When Meridian, the digital specialists, were looking at the frequency  
and amplitude of the "music data" on LP records the -highest- dynamic  
range they found was equivalent to 11-bit IIRC, though many "experts"  
attribute the inferiority of digital as they hear it to the inadequacy  
of 16 bit recording, which it almost certainly can't be. The  
shortcoming of the 44.1kHz sampling frequency is a different story in  
real engineering implementation though.
I designed high end HiFi equipment for a while. I have never seen so  
many ridiculous pseudo-technological explanations for real phenomena  
in any other field of work I have done.
cheers,
Frank


On 12 Jan, 2009, at 14:58, Eric Goldstein wrote:

> Hi Rob -
>
> I think we have to choose our words carefully here. Yes, digital
> capture will continue to evolve and continue to replace film as a
> mainstream technology. As to whether it will "surpass" it is a dicey
> matter. Remember, there are the cognoscenti who still operate analog
> tape recording studios and have no shortage of customers recording
> top-end albums there. And vinyl has reemerged as a small, top-end
> premium medium for recording distribution. Film has been the dominant
> visual technology for about a century, a remarkable stretch of time,
> and it was inevitable that it be largely replaced by something else.
> But I suspect film will remain with us as a small, top-end market for
> those who can afford to work in the best medium available. Film-makers
> such as Scorsese and Coppola have gone on record that they will NEVER
> use HD/digital capture as a first generation medium; we will see who
> will follow in their footsteps. I am confident some will even many
> years from now...
>
>
> Eric Goldstein
>
> --
>
> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 9:41 AM, Robert Lilley <54moggie@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx 
> > wrote:
>> Eric,
>>
>> But as you sort of said, it peaked and it's not evolving.  Whether  
>> I like it
>> or not, the 'emerging technology of digital imaging' will  
>> eventually surpass
>> film.
>>
>> Rob
>>
>>
>> On Jan 12, 2009, at 9:29 AM, Eric Goldstein wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Elias -
>>>
>>> Fair is in the eye of the beholder but my point really is to use the
>>> comparison to demonstrate the difference in the maturity between the
>>> two industries. 50 years ago, Rollei could design a film camera  
>>> which
>>> is still close to the best available all these many years later, and
>>> which even bests the emerging technology of digital imaging on just
>>> about every measure but low-light shooting and turn-around...
>>>
>>>
>>> Eric Goldstein
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 9:24 AM, Eric Goldstein <egoldste@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Aaron -
>>>>
>>>> Yes, I mis-spoke... it is the 25th anniversary of Macintosh.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Eric Goldstein
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jan 12, 2009 at 8:46 AM, Aaron Reece <oboeaaron@xxxxxxx>  
>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jan 11, 2009, at 8:50 PM, Eric Goldstein wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> This month is the 25th anniversary of Apple...
>>>>>
>>>>> Apologies for nitpicking (what? on THIS list?) but Apple  
>>>>> Computer was
>>>>> incorporated January 3, 1977, making it 32 years old.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>> Aaron
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