[pure-silver] Re: split tones on cold tone paper w/selenium?

That's a good way to work.  Another is to charge an hourly rate plus expenses 
to 'explore' the options if you don't have samples.  Sanity is important. :)

In my case, the lab's client is being dealt with by the counter person who's 
worked in darkrooms for years.  He's been shown a sample print and I have not, 
so I can't give any input or get a feel for what's expected.  

My involvement as their supplier, aka B&W printer/processor, is kept secret 
from their clients as well as the fact that they no longer have a wet darkroom. 
 They farm out the work whether it be color or B&W and take a cut for steering 
the work our way.  They also deal w/amateur shooters, mom's who bring their 
high school kid's film in that's late for their project and start yelling at 
them when they are told what the rush charges are going to be.  I'm glad to 
miss out on that and they also have to distill the info they receive, which has 
got to be painstaking,  into something I can interpret for printing.  My sanity 
is saved by them on probably every job they take in for me.

So my instructions are literally 'selenium toned- try as best as possible for 
split tone'.  I told the counter guy that I don't know if there will be any 
split in the tone from neutral to cold.  
So I guess my question would be what dilution would get me close or just change 
the color the most which we know will be subtle and was explained to the client 
as well?  There's no mention of using a premium warm toned paper, just plain 
ol' multigrade.  1:4?  1:9?

e



________________________________
 From: Eric Neilsen Photo <ej@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: pure-silver@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2012 5:24 PM
Subject: [pure-silver] Re: split tones on cold tone paper w/selenium?
 

 
eric, This is what I have done in the past with that type of situation.
Take a print and tone it several different way on to the
papers that they and you agree are the standard papers. Once those prints are 
delivered , those are the tones that give a good indication,
but not an exact indication that the customer receives. PERIOD.  It is only to 
preserve my sanity. Too
many mouths between too many ears and you get a higher chance of
disappointment. 
 
That being said, my regular dilution is
1:9 for quick black impact and little color shift. What are you supposed to 
split
using only one toner?   Can you use a 1:9 and then come back with
a 1:20? well yeah, does it split? ….  
 
Eric Neilsen
Eric Neilsen Photography
4101 Commerce Street, Suite 9
Dallas, TX 75226
 
www.ericneilsenphotography.com
skype me with
ejprinter
Let's Talk Photography
 

________________________________
 
From:pure-silver-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:pure-silver-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On Behalf Of Eric Nelson
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2012
4:10 PM
To: pure-silver@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [pure-silver] Re: split
tones on cold tone paper w/selenium?
 
That's
what I've been reading as well re:the touchy feely part but being the supplier
in this chain my rate is lower than normal and so is my motivation to pull out
all the stops and burn through $4+ a sheet 16x20 paper to experiment for
someone I have no contact with.  That and all the reading (i.e. research)
I'd have to do to find a good archival combination.
If
they'd come to me directly I'd have proposed something to get what they are
looking for done, but my marching orders are to try for a "split
tone" using just selenium.  
 

________________________________
 
From:Robert Hall
<robert.g.hall@xxxxxxxxx>
To: pure-silver@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
Sent: Monday, February 20, 2012
3:28 PM
Subject: [pure-silver] Re: split
tones on cold tone paper w/selenium?

Split would be
described -- at least in my mind -- as a tonal shift in
the highlights and one in the shadows.

Selenium, for example works first in the shadows and works it's way
up. Gold and sulfides can work from the top -- or highlights -- down.

Order of application is important. Too much selenium and trying to
bleach it back a bit for sulfides might not work as the selenium has
had time to affect all the silver in the print.

You might try a weakend bleach, say half strength, for 20 seconds,
then a good wash, then a sulfide toning, then let it sit in selenium
for a couple minutes at say, 1:9.

This is very touchy-feely due to the difference in papers and what
toners you use. But it's a good jumping off point.

In case you have a bit more control next time.. ask for warm tone
paper as it accepts toning -- in my opinion -- better than cold tones,
at least it is more responsive.

Robert Hall
www.RobertHall.com
www.RobertHall.com/workshops
www.facebook.com/robert.g.hall




On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 2:13 PM, Eric Nelson <emanmb@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
> Ya, exactly.
> I think the client is expecting some difference in color from the use of
one
> toner as opposed to using 2 as one might expect.  I also think
there's a
> difference between split and combination toning with the effect of a
> combination tone being a 2 color effect like sepia and iron or the like.
> e
>
> ________________________________
> From: Robert Hall <robert.g.hall@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: pure-silver@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Sent: Monday, February 20, 2012 2:35 PM
> Subject: [pure-silver] Re: split tones on cold tone paper w/selenium?
>
> Split it with what?
>
> You might get some results with sulphides and selenium.
>
> Robert Hall
> www.RobertHall.com
> www.RobertHall.com/workshops
> www.facebook.com/robert.g.hall
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2012 at 12:43 PM, Eric Nelson <emanmb@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
>> I've been asked by a lab that I'm a sub-contractor with to do split
tones
>> w/selenium on cold toned FB paper.
>>
>> Is that possible?  I'm guessing a strong selenium bath of
1:9-ish.  The
>> lab
>> I'm doing this for has spent way too much time talking to this client
and
>> they kind of guessed the guys doesn't know what he's asking for.
 My
>> thinking is that a stronger bath with cause the toner to quickly
adhere to
>> the shadows and mids while leaving the lighter tones and highlights
>> unaffected.
>>
>> Eric
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