please, look at some examples in lisp. More than that I recomand you to see some web semantic examples in lisp. This is the best language to suport the learning feature. and this learning feature is one of the most important in A.I.----- Original Message ----- From: "Ricks Place" <OFBGMail@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 11:52 PM Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages
Thanks Guys:First, This project sounds like an extreme challange but you guys and Old WillPearson use to talk about this stuff while I was still trying to learn what a class, method and property were.So thanks for putting up with what must seem to be really basic questions in an area I am not likely qualified to even scratch the surface of.I get Perceptrons. The math surrounding the more complex applications sounds daunting including Matrix Algebra upto Chaos Theory etc ( I can't remember how to spell Gausian and even the names of a couple of other mathfields mentioned ). I made it through the Calc series but any math beyond there I would have to learn from e-books, or articles, and I'm not sure how possible that would be. The Perceptron articles I read used figures, pictures, for many examples and formulas and they did not have any examples for beginning programmers to code up. So, LISP is the way to go eh? Do you remember any good primers on building very beginner orientated AI Neural Network applications with programming examples to try out in any language?Simple single layer forward only, oh darn, you know the right words... Note, I do not mind buying a e-book if it's accessible.I will research LISP on Google, do you have a favorite flavor, compiler or whatever development environment you use? I am still trying to figure out if I can learn enough AI to create a Neural Network tuned to do some Stock Market Analysis to augment my own Fundemental Analysis techniques.Rick USA Rick USA From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 3:51 PM Subject: RE: Neural Networks, Programming LanguagesPlease email me off list: sbahram@xxxxxxxxx Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of black ares Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 3:28 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages I am interested in evry kind of documentationon lisp so if you can ofer something...More than the language it self, lisp ofer a variety of dialects (scheme) orother like it.I remember that I don't know at all tcl/tk, but with my lisp knowledge I wasable to debug a program in tcl/tk. So if you have any good book on lisp and you are so kind to share it with me, i wait for it. I use lisp in my programming job. best regards Black Ares----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 10:04 PM Subject: RE: Neural Networks, Programming LanguagesTo comment a little on this. Lisp is not a functional programming language. It supports a myriad of programming styles which is why it has survived and thrived in some instances for over 50 years.Lisp supports functional, procedural, logical, aspect oriented, and objectoriented styles just to name a very small few.Also, it is truly a wonderful language. In less than 300 lines of code, I was able to write a distributed evolutionary algorithm to do the class oftraveling salesman like problems efficiently and quite nicely. As another example, the entire prolog language was implmented in lisp in the back of my introduction to lisp book, for example. Some of the three and five liners in lisp are truly mind blowing.*chuckling*, and folks think I'm a java guy, *snicker*, man do I have themfooled. I wish I had an opportunity to use lisp on a daily basis. Take care, Sina ________________________________ From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of black ares Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 2:56 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: Neural Networks, Programming Languages You can make A.I. even with visual c#, but you must make a lot of code. There are other programming paradigms more dedicated to this. 1. Functional programming (represented by lisp/scheme) 2. Logical programming (represented by prolog) for example a gcd calculation in prolog will look like: gcd(x,0,X). gcd(X,Y,D):-R is X MOD Y,gcd(Y,R,D). Thats all now you can make gcd(15,5,X). and in d you will have the result. Compare this with a traditional procedural/oop programming euclid algorithm and you will see the benefits. For having A.I. is necessary to have the learning capability in your software that means that a method have to change is behavior from a calling to another. To be more explicit let say we have a method that receive 2 parameters x and y to integers at first call the method returns the sum of the two numbers. Some where in time at another call the same method with same parameters have to return the product of the two integers. that according to some lines which are between those two calls. And this change in behavior must be not predictivso you can not do an if in the method and according to an conditon returneither the sum or the product. For this situation functional programming respond better than other paradigms.Because in a functional programming language you can modify the body of afunction easy from call to call. in c# in dotnet 2.0 this is posible only using reflection. dotnet 3.0 introduced 2 new things that I like very much 1. linq 2. f# Also you can find on the net libraries written for c# used to interpret lisp/prolog. I worked with some of them in time to get faster results. best regards. bBlack Ares----- Original Message ----- From: Ricks Place <mailto:OFBGMail@xxxxxxxxx>To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 1:40 PM Subject: Neural Networks, Programming Languages Hi Guys: Just looking at overviews of how Neural Networks are used to predictStock Market movements. Is the AI done an any language like Vb.net or arethere specific Programming languages used here. I am just looking at the possibilities to see if my programming and math knowledge would allow me to play with them some. I have a good background in math, stats and Vb.net and can, of course, learn other things if necessary but what might they be? Rick USA __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
__________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind