RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely blind?

According to this book the open source dev kit works on other platforms but
truthfully I wouldn't go that route.  Now there is the titanium stuff that
is cross platform that you can code one set of source for both android and
IPHone on any platform. But it is a java environment and I have not got it
to work with a screen reader yet.

ken

-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bryan Garaventa
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 1:41 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely blind?

I'm coming in late on this thread, so this may have been asked or already 
mentioned, is this possible on a Windows machine?
It looks like only Mac platforms can be used to develop apps that will be 
hosted in the App Store. Hopefully I'm wrong about this.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dave" <davidct1209@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely blind?


> Should have mentioned this earlier...start reading from Ch.3.
>
> Ignore all the stuff about jail breaking/hacking.  You just want to
> read about how to write app's using UIKit.  That's perfectly legal for
> Apple app's.  You'll need to download the iPhone SDK and XCode bundle.
>
> As far as discrepancies with the latest version of iOS, you'll have to
> read Apple's docs on it for iOS 4.
>
> The reference is good because it's from the ground up how a UIKit app
> works; admitedly, it's a little dated, but its perfect since there
> wasn't Interface Builder support back then.
>
> On 3/30/11, Ken Perry <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>  I started reading that book you recommended.  I don't think it is what I

>> am
>> looking for it teaches you how to hack your IPhone and create open source
>> software but not software that Apple would take in their App store it 
>> looks
>> like.  Sure you will learn a lot about the phone and be able to build 
>> stuff
>> but this is 1 about phones with version 1.0 of the 3gs software and two 
>> it
>> creates software I cannot sell with how apple has locked down the app 
>> store.
>> Do you have a better reference or am I looking at the wrong book?
>>
>> Ken
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Dave
>> Sent: Wednesday, March 30, 2011 12:58 AM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely 
>> blind?
>>
>> Ken,
>>
>> Perhaps you should read my email again too...I never said IOS was
>> easier to develop for nor did I say that Android's hard.  I wouldn't
>> trust a blind person to lay out an interface regardless of the
>> platform.  As for how easy/hard, it's all in the learning curve.
>> What's hard for you may be easy for me.  As long as you learn the
>> programmatic structures that underly the interface (i.e. UIKit),
>> you're perfectly capable of expressing a user interface on iOS.
>> Instead of writing markup (XML) and setting attributes, you're adding
>> subviews to a hierarchy of controls in objective C and setting
>> properties on objective C objects.  If you've done javascript, this is
>> like manipulating the DOM; not that much to it, just a little more of
>> a learning curve.
>>
>> For the long answer on how to write the fruit basket program (if
>> anyone's so inclined), I don't happen to have the time, see the
>> following resource:
>>
http://www.bookshare.org/browse/book/42107?returnPath=L3NlYXJjaD9rZXl3b3JkPW
>> lQaG9uZSBPcGVuIEFwcGxpY2F0aW9uIERldmVsb3BtZW50Jg%3D%3D
>>
>> Again, this isn't an excuse -- Apple needs to provide access to IB
>> with VoiceOver, but if you master UIkit, you can do as good of a job
>> on an interface as Ken does on Android using xml layout files...
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/29/11, Ken Perry <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> Um you call that a defense?  A company that has over 100 accessibility
>>> people couldn't put a phone out with access in it first?  They freely
>> admit
>>> they screwed up they have no excuse not one.  Apple on the other hand 
>>> went
>>> from nothing to much much better.  The opposite is the case in 
>>> Microsoft.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jared
>> Stofflett
>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2011 5:56 PM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>> blind?
>>>
>>> In microsoft's defence they know accessibility is something that needs
>>> to be worked on for Windows Phone 7. According to the following
>>> article it may take up to two years which is how long it took for the
>>> iPhone to be accessible.
>>>
>>
http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2010/12/microsoft_incom.ht
>>> ml;jsessionid=ZEWBTHKQSCWK5QE1GHPSKH4ATMY32JVN
>>> While microsoft claims they dropped the ball I could see not holding
>>> up a release as for accessibility as a valid business decision. If I
>>> were a PR department I would never state so publically though and
>>> screwing up sounds better then ignoring a small subset of users with
>>> special needs in an effort to gain market share before it's to late.
>>>
>>> On 3/29/11, Ken Perry <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>> Yeah I have that installed I just haven't had time to read the docs.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Johannes 
>>>> Grib
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2011 12:40 AM
>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>> blind?
>>>>
>>>> Came across this just yesterday, hope to test it out but want to share 
>>>> as
>>>> I'm sure some one else might find it of interest too.
>>>>
>>>> "The Only Open Source Mobile Framework That Supports 6 Platforms.
>>>>
>>>> PhoneGap is an HTML5 app platform that allows you to author native
>>>> applications with web technologies and get access to APIs and app
>> stores."
>>>>
>>>> See http://www.phonegap.com/
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of black ares
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 29, 2011 6:18
>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: Re: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>> blind?
>>>>
>>>> how ever, Adobe don't seems to care very much about the accessibility 
>>>> of
>>> his
>>>> tools.
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Ken Perry" <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 11:36 PM
>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>> blind?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Be my guest
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no idea nore would I write a hello world in flash.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Client
>>>>> Services
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 4:17 PM
>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> What about using Adobe Flash CS5?
>>>>> They allow you to convert flash programs to the iphone platform.
>>>>>
>>>>> Warmest Regards,
>>>>> H.R. Soltani
>>>>> Star Federal, Inc.
>>>>> Management, Consulting, and Development
>>>>> When you prosper, we succeed!
>>>>> Mailing Address: 228 Park Avenue South, #24165, New York, NY 10003
>>>>> New York City Phone: (212) 561-5811
>>>>> Washington DC Phone: 202-559-7200
>>>>> Toll-Free Phone: (800) 212-2805
>>>>> Fax: (800) 902-6049
>>>>> Website: StarFederal.com
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 4:05 PM
>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> Coding in objective c is not the problem.  The problem is the 
>>>>> interface
>>>>> builder in xcode.  You can fight and get some crappy dialog test 
>>>>> program
>>>>> going but if you're trying to create software for the IPhone and you
>>> don't
>>>>> have someone to do the GUI you will not be able to get very far.  If
>> your
>>>>> coding for the mac your choices are better because there is an
>> accessible
>>>>> way of doing things.  So far that is not the case for IPhone.  I am 
>>>>> not
>>>>> saying you cannot code things but it is not something you will have 
>>>>> much
>>>>> luck with if your totally blind.  Another thing to know is that you 
>>>>> have
>>>>> to
>>>>> have a Mac to code for the IPhone unless you use Titanium but the
>> problem
>>>>> with Titanium is it is a java tool and not accessible with 64 bit
>>> machines
>>>>> because of the access bridge.  All though that might be different now
>>> that
>>>>> the new access bridge is out.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DaShiell,
>>> Jude
>>>>> T. CIV NAVAIR 1490, 1, 26
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 3:02 PM
>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> I have no direct knowledge of Objective C so can't answer that 
>>>>> question.
>>>>> I asked what language iPhone used as its native language and got this
>>>>> information back on aiphones mailing list.  Probably a good question 
>>>>> for
>>>>> me to ask and have answered before I ask a long standing friend to do
>>>>> some research for me is what hardware platform is expected to be put 
>>>>> to
>>>>> use doing the programming?  That may or may not make a difference.  My
>>>>> long standing friend is busy but will help out as she has a chance
>>>>> provided intelligent questions come her way so I want to have the 
>>>>> bases
>>>>> covered before contacting her.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Homme, 
>>>>> James
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 14:48
>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> Does that translate to yes or no?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of DaShiell,
>>>>> Jude T. CIV NAVAIR 1490, 1, 26
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 2:33 PM
>>>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> Subject: RE: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> iPhone uses Objective C as its native language.  Doing accessible
>>>>> programming requires Objective C and compliance with Cocoa standards.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jared
>>>>> Stofflett
>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2011 11:41
>>>>> To: programmingblind
>>>>> Subject: Is it possible to do iPhone programming while completely 
>>>>> blind?
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it possible to do iPhone programming when completely blind? My
>>>>> understanding is I will need to buy a mac. My experience with macs
>>>>> consists of going through part of the voiceover tutorial and learning
>>>>> just enough to add my self as a user on my friends computer using
>>>>> voiceover. Any information on what type of System would be best for
>>>>> iPhone programming is appreciated.
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