RE: Creating an Operating System with speech included

  • From: "Ken Perry" <whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sun, 7 Dec 2008 11:02:01 -0500


I took 1 month to get so used to the indentation I don't even think of it
and I did not start with Python as I have previously said so your just
arguing to argue here.

Ken

-----Original Message-----
From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Octavian Rasnita
Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 3:38 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included

Of course you get used with the indentation if it was the first language you

learnt.
But most other programmers don't start with Python, and almost all other 
languages don't need that indentation restriction, so usually they are not 
used with it, especially if they are blind.

Octavian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Nimer" <nimerjaber1@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 6:16 AM
Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included


> Ken,
> I am just now switching over to Linux, and I really like its robustness. I

> am still learning the terminal commands though. How is the administrative 
> interface accessed? I have read over tutorials about how to do it, and 
> nothing has worked on my machine. I have created the orbitrc file, that 
> did not work. I tried enabling the root account, but I am unable to log 
> into it directly, only indirectly. When I launch Orca through the terminal

> as root, orca does not start. When I tri to run Orca normally, it comes 
> up, but does not speak. It simply says: Welcome to Orca. When I go from 
> window to window, I get the message "inaccessible". I want to switch to 
> Linux, but I need to access basic settings under networking, software 
> sources, synaptic package manager, etc.
> Any advice, tips, tricks, etc would be greatfully received.
>
> And, as for the accessibility of python, It was the first language I 
> learned. I attempted to play with Java last year for a class, and frankly 
> did not like it compared to Python. You get used to the indentation. What 
> I like about it is that it is not very restrictive. You can run a short 
> chunk of code. And, you do not have to look things up in such things as 
> javadocs. You can call up a list of functions in a class.
> Thanks
> Nimer J
>
> Nimer M. Jaber
>
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> Website:
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>
>
> Ken Perry wrote:
>> Ok I need to clear up my previous statement.  I said it was around the 
>> 3.3
>> jaws stage.  I meant that only in how easy it is to use.  The fact is 
>> orca
>> is already more powerful than Jaws 3.3 it is closer to jaws 4.5 which is
>> when it got useful in XP the problem is there are times when Orca will 
>> crash
>> and if you are not a geek some times its hard to get running.  It's also 
>> got
>> a bit harder to use interface because there is just so many options.  For
>> example if you run up orca in Ubuntu 8.04 and go into firefox and don't 
>> know
>> that you have to do insert f-12 and change it to orca bindings you will 
>> find
>> that firefox is a bit clugy.  If you do know to switch it you will find 
>> that
>> firefox works better than with Jaws.  You will also find that the Pigeon
>> communication client is harder to use than that of Aim, msn, and or skype
>> but  if you learn to use it you will find it is more powerful and covers 
>> a
>> lot more messaging protocols.  You will also find that Open office 
>> actually
>> runs good with Orca where it just runs with Jaws.  The one thing they 
>> have
>> to do in Linux is get a OCR program without an OCR program that works 
>> good
>> it just is not worth it I can't scan books or bills or nothing and the 
>> free
>> ocr program google has right now is not ready for prime time but that 
>> could
>> change rapidly so I am always hoping.
>>
>> So when I say it's at the jaws 3.3 range I should say in interface and 
>> ease
>> to learn and use.  When it comes to power its better than 3.3 but it's 
>> still
>> not up to Windows eyes 7 or Jaws 7 or system access standards yet but it 
>> is
>> getting there fast.
>>
>> I haven't tried the sun java developer but I hear its fully accessible 
>> with
>> Orca and if that's true that's really cool so I will give that a shot 
>> next
>> time I get one of those rare free moments.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Octavian 
>> Rasnita
>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 1:41 PM
>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>
>> Well that's not good news. :-(
>> I've started to use Jaws from the version 3.6 or 3.8 or something like 
>> that,
>>
>> and if you say that Orca compares with Jaws 3.3, it means that it is even
>> less advanced than what I thought.
>>
>> But OpenSolaris isn't Unix? It is just another distribution of Linux?
>>
>> In my mind I always associated Sun with Unix because I thought that SunOS
>> and Solaris are Unix operating systems, and I also thought that Unix work
>> only on Unix servers and workstations, and only Linux is a kind of Unix 
>> made
>>
>> for PC.
>>
>> But or I am wrong and Solaris is not Unix, or Sun fool us and use the 
>> same
>> name of Solaris for 2 different operating systems, one of them beeing 
>> Unix
>> and the other one beeing a Linux distribution.
>>
>> Can anyone make some light?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>>
>>
>> Octavian
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Ken Perry"<whistler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 7:39 PM
>> Subject: RE: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>
>>
>>
>>> Actually both orca linux and Solaris are about the same.  I would put 
>>> them
>>> around Jaws 3.3 access right now.  I run Ubuntu because it's the easiest
>>> to
>>> get working on my laptop.  I also run Redhat 9 on my server and have no
>>> troubles with it if you don't mind hacking a bit.
>>>
>>> Ken
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Octavian
>>> Rasnita
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 6:50 AM
>>> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>
>>> That's good news. Does OpenSolaris and Orca offer a better accessibility
>>> than Windows with Jaws?
>>>
>>> Or at least does it offer a better accessibility than Ubuntu with Orca?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> Octavian
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "black ares"<matematicianu2003@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 12:47 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> yes, solaris is a unix platform and it suports orca.
>>>> at least for x86 cpu family
>>>> i've worked with solaris 10,
>>>> i've downloaded it from sun site for free.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Octavian Rasnita"<orasnita@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 12:01 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, but I think you don't know what you are talking about.
>>>>>
>>>>> First, I didn't say that Jaws is a Microsoft program. I said only that
>>>>> the best accessibility is offered by Windows and Jaws and not by Orca
>>>>> and
>>>>> Linux, but not even the comparison between these 2 is important, but 
>>>>> the
>>>>> fact that it is very hard to create another OS with another screen
>>>>> reader
>>>>> built in.
>>>>>
>>>>> Second, I know that Orca works with Linux, but Sun doesn't pretend 
>>>>> that
>>>>> they've created the most advanced Linux OS, but that they've created
>>>>> Solaris, the most advanced OS.
>>>>> However, Solaris is not accessible for the blind, or it is accessible
>>>>> but
>>>>> only by using emacspeak, which has a very ugly interface and offers a
>>>>> poor accessibility anyway, and I haven't tested Solaris so I don't
>>>>> really
>>>>> know if it really supports emacspeak or it is just a future plan for
>>>>> Sun.
>>>>>
>>>>> By the way, have anyone tried Solaris?
>>>>>
>>>>> Octavian
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "black ares"<matematicianu2003@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 11:39 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> don't forget that jaws is not a microsoft software and, taking 
>>>>>> software
>>>>>> only from the two grand companies, sun is better than microsoft.
>>>>>> Because, with orca you can do more than with narator from windows.
>>>>>> So Sun has right assuming it as the best company offering an advanced
>>>>>> os
>>>>>> with speak.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Octavian Rasnita"<orasnita@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 10:08 AM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Windows is an operating system with speech included. Do you want to
>>>>>>> create a
>>>>>>> better OS than Windows and a better screen reader than Narrator?
>>>>>>> I guess you want to create a better one, because otherwise... why
>>>>>>> bother?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In order to do that, you should create a company, employ a few
>>>>>>> thousands of
>>>>>>> good programmers and after very many years you might do it.
>>>>>>> Sun Microsystems has tens of thousands of programmers and they 
>>>>>>> pretend
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> they have created the most advanced operating system in the world, 
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>> have also made one of the most used screen readers for Linux, but 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> accessibility offered by their solutions is much lower than the one
>>>>>>> offered
>>>>>>> by Windows and screen readers like Jaws, and Sun work on their OS 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> very
>>>>>>> many years, so... it could be very hard to do what you want.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Octavian
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: "Jose Lomeli"<jose.lomeli93@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>> To:<programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 10:05 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: Creating an Operating System with speech included
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello; Listers, I just thought.  What do I have to do to create a
>>>>>>>> operating system with speech.  I just thought about this.  Can this
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> done? Please write back.
>>>>>>>>  From Jose Lomeli.
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