Re: Cognos Accessibility with JAWS

Hi,

I guess, I had similar problem with my company's bug logging system -
there's a save button icon, but with virtual cursor, I was not able to
figure out where it was.

The temporary solution I found was that, I got pare of eyes place the
mouse cursor on the button icon, labeled the icon (with jaws graphic
labeler) and then counted the number of key presses moving towards the
left (or right, where appropriate) untill some text is encountered.

Next time, when Irequired to click that button I go to the text and
used arrow keys to find the button and most of the time it worked.

I know, this is not at all an efficient way - but it worked that time
this way only and I didn't work on it any further as we used to use
the logging system rarely at that time.

HTH

Varun

On 9/29/09, Dorene Cornwell <dorenefc@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> Alt V  for the view window
> Arrow down to Source (C)
>
> That should show a new window with whatever you can see of the source.
>
> But if Cognos is not showing the source, you really may be at the end
> of what you can do without working with their technical support.
>
> Good luck
>
> DC
>
> On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 2:48 PM, Brent Neal <bneal@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> We tried getting to the source and it seems to be blocked.  Can you give
>> me
>> step by step instructions in case we are not doing it correctly?
>>
>> Brent Neal
>> 140 E 300 S
>> Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>
>> Programmer
>> Phone:  801.526.9797
>> Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>
>>>>> Dorene Cornwell <dorenefc@xxxxxxxxx> 9/28/2009 3:03 PM >>>
>> Another thought:
>>
>> Once you have a view of the HTML source from your browser, see if the
>> pair of eyes you have been borrowing can spot anything that is
>> different between the stuff you can find and the stuff you cannot.
>>
>> DC
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 28, 2009 at 11:44 AM, R. Haynie <rhaynie@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>> Yes, you can copy and paste the source of the html page.  I believe the
>>> source is accessed via View/Source in IE6.
>>>
>>> Paste it into the reply of this email and send as plain text.  Unless it
>>> is
>>> a lot of code.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Brent Neal wrote:
>>>
>>> Yes.  I access Cognos using Windows Internet Explorer 6 because that is
>>> the
>>> version the state is currently using because of some other applications.
>>> I
>>> do not think you can get to Cognos without a licence.  Is there more
>>> information I can give you that would help?
>>>
>>> Brent Neal
>>> 140 E 300 S
>>> Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>
>>> Programmer
>>> Phone:  801.526.9797
>>> Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>>>> "R. Haynie" <rhaynie@xxxxxxxxxxx> 9/28/2009 11:32 AM >>>
>>> Ok, so now we may be getting somewhere.  Is this accessed through a web
>>> browser?
>>> If so, it might help you to take a look at the source after the page has
>>> been rendered.  It might lead to showing what elements/components are
>>> used
>>> for their UI.
>>>
>>> You might want to sent the source to the list or if possible  (and I
>>> would
>>> guess not) send a URL to us so we could look at the situation.
>>>
>>> -Rodney
>>>
>>>
>>> Brent Neal wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Jim,
>>> One key bit of information I forgot to mention it that this version of
>>> Cognos is a web application.  In the Hotspotclicker documentation it
>>> talks
>>> about inserting JAWS scripts into the application.  Will Hotspotclicker
>>> work
>>> on web applications?
>>>
>>> Brent Neal
>>> 140 E 300 S
>>> Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>
>>> Programmer
>>> Phone:  801.526.9797
>>> Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>>>> Jim Bauer <holdsworthfan@xxxxxx> 9/24/2009 10:28 AM >>>
>>> Yes. It's not dependent on what JAWS sees; it blindly clicks a
>>> position in its most basic form. There are safeguards, but if you
>>> "defined a hotspot" with "app main window relative" positioning, you'd
>>> be fine.
>>>
>>> Jim
>>>
>>>
>>> "Brent Neal" <bneal@xxxxxxxx> wrote on Thu, 24 Sep 2009 10:14:14
>>> -0600:
>>>
>>>>Hi Jim,
>>>>Thanks for the information.  I went to the hotspotclicker website and
>>>> read
>>>> through some of the information.  Do you know if this would work on an
>>>> icon
>>>> that JAWS cannot even seem to find?
>>>>
>>>>Brent Neal
>>>>140 E 300 S
>>>>Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>>
>>>>Programmer
>>>>Phone:  801.526.9797
>>>>Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Jim Bauer <holdsworthfan@xxxxxx> 9/24/2009 9:55 AM >>>
>>>>Hotspot Clicker will get you up and running in the shortest amount of
>>>>time and without you having to sit in front of your favorite text
>>>>editor, testing and debugging JAWS script code. <G>
>>>>
>>>>Borrow a pair of eyes while you position the JAWS cursor over the
>>>>appropriate items. You can choose to position relative to either
>>>>screen height/width or the dimentions of the application main
>>>>window.
>>>>
>>>>"Brent Neal" <bneal@xxxxxxxx> wrote on Thu, 24 Sep 2009 09:41:16
>>>>-0600:
>>>>
>>>>>With further sighted assistance I have better information.
>>>>>In insertable objects there are 3 tabs.  The screen comes up in the
>>>>> default tab which is source.  If the sighted user clicks on one of the
>>>>> other
>>>>> tabs either data items or Toolbox than JAWS will read what is in it but
>>>>> I
>>>>> cannot get JAWS to find the other tabs.  This seems like such a simple
>>>>> problem but it makes it unusable for me.  It is probably just because
>>>>> the
>>>>> developer did not label the tabs so that JAWS knows they are there.  We
>>>>> have
>>>>> the same problem with the tabs in the next part of the screen which is
>>>>> called the Page Explorer.
>>>>>Let me know if you have any other suggestions.
>>>>>Thank You
>>>>>
>>>>>Brent Neal
>>>>>140 E 300 S
>>>>>Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>>>
>>>>>Programmer
>>>>>Phone:  801.526.9797
>>>>>Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dorene Cornwell <dorenefc@xxxxxxxxx> 9/24/2009 12:45 AM >>>
>>>>>This is going to sound flip, but have you tried Ctrl Tab  ?
>>>>>
>>>>>Good luck
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>>On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 3:21 PM, Brent Neal <bneal@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>>>>> The 3 icons I cannot access are actually called tabs in the
>>>>>> documentation.
>>>>>> They are referred to as the Toolbox tab, Data Items tab and Source tab
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> the Insertable Objects Pane.
>>>>>> Is there a special way to access tabs?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Brent Neal
>>>>>> 140 E 300 S
>>>>>> Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Programmer
>>>>>> Phone:  801.526.9797
>>>>>> Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dorene Cornwell <dorenefc@xxxxxxxxx> 9/23/2009 1:16 PM >>>
>>>>>> Brent
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In cases like this, I am a great believer in making the Cognos tech
>>>>>> support staff earn their keep. Web-based report-writing is too
>>>>>> important a function. Cognos is too important a product;
>>>>>> decisionmakers for organizations of all sizes SHOULD be considering
>>>>>> accessibility in their purchasing decisions and Cognos should not be
>>>>>> allowed to slide and palm all the work off on you or your IT shop. You
>>>>>> are basically beta-testing and intentionally or not helping them with
>>>>>> necessary development work.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the hotspot clicker idea also sounds interesting. What
>>>>>> screenreader and version of JAWS are you using? I have not read all
>>>>>> the wonders that JAWS 10 is supposed to work with dynamic updates of
>>>>>> the screen, but I would think to look there.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Keep us all posted. This is important work!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> DoreneC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Sep 23, 2009 at 11:39 AM, Jim Bauer <holdsworthfan@xxxxxx>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Alas, I know nothing of Cognos itself, though I'll write anyway with
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>> couple *helpful* bits about your problem(s):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm sure Geoff C is composing a thesis extolling the virtues of
>>>>>>> Hotspot Clicker, so I'll beat him to it. <grin>. Any time you're
>>>>>>> talking about coordinate-based positioning in areas that have the
>>>>>>> potential for going dynamic, it's definitely the easiest, most
>>>>>>> customizable option.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Are the sectioned-off elements you seek actual windows or just
>>>>>>> "chunks" of information written to one large window that represents
>>>>>>> the screen area?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> P.S. If you're unaware, Hotspot Clicker can be found at
>>>>>>> http://www.hotspotclicker.org
>>>>>>> "Brent Neal" <bneal@xxxxxxxx> wrote on Wed, 23 Sep 2009 12:25:21
>>>>>>> -0600:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Here at work I was put on the data warehouse team because they
>>>>>>>> thought
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> could learn Cognos and create Cognos reports.  So far Cognos on the
>>>>>>>> web has
>>>>>>>> been quite accessible accept we cannot seem to get to the Source,
>>>>>>>> Toolbox
>>>>>>>> and Data Items icons which are in the center part of the screen.  I
>>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>> sighted assistance in labeling the icons but JAWS still does not
>>>>>>>> recognize
>>>>>>>> them.  Is there any way to get around this problem?  If not I will
>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>> able to create the reports.
>>>>>>>>Also the screen is divided into 3 sections and I need to find a way
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> switch between sections.  They are not frames or tables.  Does
>>>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>>> how to do this?
>>>>>>>>Is anyone else using Cognos with JAWS?
>>>>>>>>Any help will be appreciated.
>>>>>>>>Thank You
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Brent Neal
>>>>>>>>140 E 300 S
>>>>>>>>Salt Lake City, UT 84111
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Programmer
>>>>>>>>Phone:  801.526.9797
>>>>>>>>Email:  bneal@xxxxxxxx
>>>>>>>
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-- 
Varun
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