RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

  • From: "Homme, James" <james.homme@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2011 11:30:46 -0400

Hi,
This isn't one of thus my language is better than yours posts.

I realize I'm opening up a big can of argumentitive worms here, but I would 
like to ask this. From what I'm reading, the Python people are seeming to say 
that everything, even if it looks like it's not an object gets turned into one. 
Am I reading  correctly? In case I'm reading incorrectly, which is likely, 
check this out. 
http://diveintopython.org/getting_to_know_python/everything_is_an_object.html.

Thanks.

Jim

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Sina Bahram
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 10:14 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

One minor correction, java is not a fully object oriented language. It's 
practicle in that there are still primatives like int, float, and so on. They 
do have object counterparts though.

But yes, compared to Python and the rest, it's more object oriented than 
anything those guys have to offer.

Take care,
Sina

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 8:05 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Well the problem with Java is that it is a full object oriented language.  This 
means before writing one bit of code you need to know three things.


1)      How to import stuff

2)      2) what is an object

3)      What are methods.

Without those three things you cannot do anything in java.  That is why python 
and other interpreted languages are easier to learn.  You don't even need to 
know what a function is to make something happen in python or perl or languages 
of the type.

So I guess if I was writing a tutorial I would have to really clearly describe 
the above before anyone could go on.  Now with that said once you learn those 
three things Eclipse gets you going quick.  If  a person doesn't understand 
methods (functions in java) it doesn't matter if they are using eclipse or 
notepad they are so screwed.

Ken

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Homme, James
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 7:22 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Hi Ken,
I will definitely pop Eclipse open and take another look at the help features. 
Perhaps my frustration level goes up faster than some. The only thing I might 
argue with you about is that perhaps someone might start with Eclipse, and not 
even know what a function is. My goal was to reduce the learning curve so that 
the only thing being learned is the language.

Thanks.

Jim

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Perry
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 7:17 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

I have to disagree with this.  There is nothing like using eclipse when you're 
learning a language.  Let's say you are in Android and need to make an 
Application.  Ok so you start it up and there is an Activity class.  You're in 
your text editor what do you do?

You go out on line or into a document and try to read up on all the possible 
functions you can run in an activity.   Not bad but why not make it quicker.

Just arrow to your myactivity and use the source menu and go down and select 
override members.  Then you can arrow through the list of things you have that 
you can do in that class.  You check a few and tab down and hit ok.  Now you 
have 6 stub functions that work perfect.  You then go down to the keydown 
function that you just added  and arrow over keyEvent and select help it tells 
you all the functions

Eclipse and Visual studio are  not just environments but they are  great 
learning tools.  Not to mention learning the environment now with an easy 
program will  speed up both development of a harder program but it also teaches 
you how to download other peoples projects and get them running.

Heck for that matter if you don't use eclipse you have to learn another way to 
compile your project.  Which normally means you start compiling at the command 
line with javac.  That sounds easy but how many of you have tried this and ran 
into the java path problems.  That is not something you want to get a new user 
into right away.  Then if you want to get real bold and use ant as a new 
programmer you better have a lot of antacid.

So I guess in short I just wanted to say sure Eclipse is a big pig but the 
gains for a new coder is pretty high if you learn to use it.  Now if you're on 
a Mac sorry to hear it while I like Mac I have not been impressed with the 
amount of work I had to go through to get Eclipse set up.  I use it on both Mac 
and Windows but I will tell you there is nothing like Eclipse and Jaws 12.  I 
use no scripts and do just fine.

Ken

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Homme, James
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 6:49 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Hi Brandon,
This is my opinion, so take with a grain of salt. Right at the beginning with 
Java, I feel that you should use a text editor. Personally, I prefer EdSharp, 
but there  are lots of good ones. Learn to use the command line tools that come 
with the Java Development Kit. After you have written some programs, and you 
know what's going on with basic Java, start to use something like Eclipse or 
Net Beans. I have no experience with SodBeans, but I understand that that 
package for NetBeans is making a big difference in NetBeans accessibility. So 
scrap fancy editors for now.

Jim

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Brandon Keith 
(Biggs)
Sent: Thursday, July 07, 2011 12:17 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Thanks and I started reading those, the only problem is I use Eclipse and these 
talk about the Netbeans IDE which I think it is inaccessible.
My big question is: What are all the differences in the different things you 
can create with the new menu in Eclipse? There are like projects, classes, Java 
projects and all kinds of other things that aren't really talked about with 
Java.
Thanks,

Brandon Keith Biggs

Check out
MySpace: http://www.myspace.com/brandonkeithbiggs
Also add me on facebook!
brandonkeith
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=675097942
And for my resume go to:
http://www.sfcasting.com/brandonkeith

From: Homme, James<mailto:james.homme@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 9:36 AM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Hi,
I think that, as with many things, this is one of those things that can be 
different, depending on the learning style and knowledge of the person.

Speaking just for myself, I get more out of tutorial style books, when I'm 
learning a language. I tend to freeze up at reference type material that is 
full of code and short on words, but that's my taste.

According to me, you will probably do well with the nutshell books, if you 
already know lots of programming concepts and want to see how certain things 
are done in Java. On the other hand, you may do better if you have little 
programming experience by looking at the Java Tutorial, which takes things a 
concept at a time and explains them with lots of words and examples. You can 
see that at http://download.oracle.com/javase/tutorial/reallybigindex.html.

Thanks.

Jim

From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of qubit
Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 12:30 PM
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

I would recommend if you have a subscription to bookshare.org, that you 
download a copy of "Java in a Nutshell".  It is a nice summary of features with 
some examples.  I was going to read "Thinking in Java, 4th edition", which I 
forked $25 for online, but got a package that I cann't display on my system.  I 
have been unable to read more than the preface, and most the time, the html 
just freezes things.  So I'm pitching it.  A shame as it sounds like a useful 
guide to using java the way it is meant to be used.

Online there are also common tasks implemented in java, which you can find in 
http://commons.apache.org/
Good luck and happy hacking.
--le

----- Original Message -----
From: Florian Beijers<mailto:florianbeijers@xxxxxxxxx>
To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, July 06, 2011 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: Best Java Guides for a Newby?

Hello Brandon,

Do you have any form of IM or perhaps skype? I would like to help you but it's 
easier for me to recommend something if i know a bit more about your background.

Florian
On Jul 6, 2011, at 8:04 AM, Brandon Keith (Biggs) wrote:

Hello,
I'm new to programming, (I have just made it past "Hello World") and am looking 
for some guides.
I would like to learn Java, but I'm not quite sure where to start. I downloaded 
the 500 or so documents from the "Java Documentation" at:
http://www.nonvisualdevelopment.org/node/20
as well as reading all the tutorials on Eclipse and Java.
I've installed the SDK 1.6 and Eclipse, is there anything else I need? I see 
there are Jaws scripts for Eclipse, where do I insert those?
I arrowed through the 500 documents dealing with Java and found:
Java Tutorial 3rd Edition, a short course on the basics
but I see it was written in 2001 and only deals with Java 1.3 and Windows 2000 
and before. Is this something I should read? What books best describe the 
language in an exciting and useful format? I'm wanting to eventually program 
for Android, but I think that is stepping a little ahead of myself.
Where do I start?
Thanks,

Brandon Keith Biggs

Check out
MySpace: http://www.myspace.com/brandonkeithbiggs
Also add me on facebook!
brandonkeith
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=675097942
And for my resume go to:
http://www.sfcasting.com/brandonkeith


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