Re: should one use ANSI join syntax when writing an Oracle application?

My personal preference is for the ANSI standard syntax, I really find that
seperating out the joins from the other conditions helps me understand more
easily what a query is trying to achieve. It also helps debugging IMO.

As for bugs, well there was a famous bug in 9.0.1 (base release) that
rendered the database insecure, but I can't say that since then I have come
across any great instances of wrong results with them - and I'd wager they
were fewer than wrong results due to my not writing a query accurately first
time. You could certainly look at the known issues lists (I referred to them
at
http://orawin.info/services/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=65&Itemid=34)
and the fixed bugs lists in 10.2.0.2 and 9.2.0.7.

So I'd say that by and large my experience has been positive and that I find
the style a lot easier to understand.

On 10/16/06, Jacques Kilchoer <Jacques.Kilchoer@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: 

 I also found that when reading about ANSI joins at asktom.oracle.com, but
I notice that Oracle seems to be recommending the ANSI outer join syntax
since it allows you to write queries that couldn't be written with the (+)
operator. However, all the queries I have written so fat that use outer
joins can be written with the (+) operator.

The main thing I gather from the description below is that, perhaps,
Oracle intends to add enhancements to the ANSI join syntax that it won't add
to the old-style join syntax? (e.g. the last 3 items in your documentation
excerpt:  A WHERE condition containing the (+) operator cannot be combined
with another condition using the OR logical operator; A WHERE condition
cannot use the IN comparison condition to compare a column marked with the
(+) operator with an expression; A WHERE condition cannot compare any
column marked with the (+) operator with a subquery.)

My question, I guess, is have many people run into bugs with ANSI joins,
or are the bugs rare and only happening with very convoluted queries?

 ------------------------------
*De :* Allen, Brandon [mailto:Brandon.Allen@xxxxxxxxxxx]
 Here is what Oracle has to say about it - from
http://download-west.oracle.com/docs/cd/B19306_01/server.102/b14200/queries006.htm
:


Oracle recommends that you use the FROM clause OUTER JOIN syntax rather
than the Oracle join operator. Outer join queries that use the Oracle join
operator (+) are subject to the following rules and restrictions, which do
not apply to the FROM clause OUTER JOIN syntax:

   -

   You cannot specify the (+) operator in a query block that also
   contains FROM clause join syntax.
   -

   The (+) operator can appear only in the WHERE clause or, in the
   context of left-correlation (that is, when specifying the TABLEclause) in the
   FROM clause, and can be applied only to a column of a table or view.
   -

   If A and B are joined by multiple join conditions, then you must use
   the (+) operator in all of these conditions. If you do not, then Oracle
   Database will return only the rows resulting from a simple join, but without
   a warning or error to advise you that you do not have the results of an
   outer join.
   -

   The (+) operator does not produce an outer join if you specify one
   table in the outer query and the other table in an inner query.
   -

   You cannot use the (+) operator to outer-join a table to itself,
   although self joins are valid. For example, the following statement is
   not valid:

   -- The following statement is not valid:
   SELECT employee_id, manager_id
      FROM employees
      WHERE employees.manager_id(+) = employees.employee_id;

   However, the following self join is valid:

   SELECT e1.employee_id, e1.manager_id, e2.employee_id
      FROM employees e1, employees e2
      WHERE e1.manager_id(+) = e2.employee_id;



   -

   The (+) operator can be applied only to a column, not to an
   arbitrary expression. However, an arbitrary expression can contain one or
   more columns marked with the (+) operator.
   -

   A WHERE condition containing the (+) operator cannot be combined
   with another condition using the OR logical operator.
   -

   A WHERE condition cannot use the IN comparison condition to compare
   a column marked with the (+) operator with an expression.
   -

   A WHERE condition cannot compare any column marked with the (+)
   operator with a subquery.


 ------------------------------
*From:* oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Jacques Kilchoer

 Let us suppose that I were to be writing a PL/SQL package that will be
installed on a variety of databases in my company, and not all the databases
are at the same version or patch level (but all are 9.2 and up).
Would it be a good idea to use ANSI join syntax in the queries in the
package? Knowing that a non-negligeable portion of the queries will be using
outer joins?
When I search on Metalink, I see bugs relating to the ANSI join syntax,
but I also see bugs reported against the (+) style outer join syntax. Of the
bugs I see mentioned on Metalink, many were "unpublished" bugs so I couldn't
see the details.

I was thinking of using the ANSI join syntax because it is supposed to be
easier to read and understand for people coming from non-Oracle
environments, more portable, perhaps even "the wave of the future" (?) as I
heard it described in one presentation.

Would it be a mistake to use the ANSI join syntax? Should I stick with the
old-fashioned Oracle syntax for another year or so?




--
Niall Litchfield
Oracle DBA
http://www.orawin.info

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