[opendtv] Re: MPAA wants to stop DVRs from recording some movies
- From: "Adam Goldberg" <adam_g@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: <opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 26 Jun 2008 19:41:09 -0400
"Just as an example, otherwise, Brad Gates and the other MPAA folks would have
closed the analog hole in the early 00's, and assertion of the broadcast flag
would prevent all devices with a tuner from streaming content over the
Internet."
Um, that's Brad Hunt, and he's no longer with MPAA. Otherwise, right on.
-----Original Message-----
From: opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:opendtv-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of John Willkie
Sent: Thursday, June 26, 2008 6:23 PM
To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [opendtv] Re: MPAA wants to stop DVRs from recording some movies
once again, it's NOT A RIGHT; your "rights" weren't at stake. It was the
ability of Sony to make and market video cassette recorders and Universal
feeling that their rights were at stake. And, the ruling just established -- I
said that all should read it -- that one can record over the air (or otherwise
in the clear) content for time-shifting purposes and not be infringing.
A DVR is somewhat different. I had a Betamax recorder at the time. One-hour
tapes cost $20.00 (about $100.00 in current dollars) or more. They were so
precious that they would quickly be re-recorded after the initial viewing, with
rare exception. A DVR is not exactly on point, since they involve substantial
capability to accumulate a library. (This was addressed indirectly in the
Betamax decision, but as Adam noted, amounted to dicta, since the Supremes
found that time-shifting was a substantial non-infringing use. Libraries are
still a grey area.
And, you are almost off-topic with this FCC stuff, since the FCC didn't take
your favored position, and now you are trying to "hold court" with it. As even
most non-engineers can discern, the Betamax decision didn't rely on anything
having to do with the FCC, and the FCC has nothing to do with the Betamax
decision.
By the way, you are totally clueless about CE makers kow-towing to
"Hollywierd." With the (partial) exception of Sony CE and Sony Pictures, they
are fighting all the time, on many fronts, and in several fora. Just as an
example, otherwise, Brad Gates and the other MPAA folks would have closed the
analog hole in the early 00's, and assertion of the broadcast flag would
prevent all devices with a tuner from streaming content over the Internet.
Also, the FCC documents you allude to has to do merely with MVPDs, not DVRs per
se. You have to be able to understand this, on some level, since your DVRs
aren't connected to cable.
CGMS, need I say I've pointed this several times over the years, and I am not
alone, doesn't and doesn't need to respect the Betamax decision, since "copy
never" is something that actually violates the spirit of the betamax decision.
We were having such a nice, focused discussion. I won't ruin the buzz, but I
notice the tactics anew.
John Willkie
-----Original Message-----
>From: "Manfredi, Albert E" <albert.e.manfredi@xxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Jun 26, 2008 5:30 PM
>To: opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>Subject: [opendtv] Re: MPAA wants to stop DVRs from recording some movies
>
>Adam Goldberg wrote:
>
>> To the contrary. Sony v. Universal ("Betamax") held precisely
>> that time shifting is non-infringing. It did not (directly)
>> address whether librarying is non-infringing or not, it didn't
>> reach that point, as it only had to find that there was (a)
>> substantial non-infringing use, and (b) devices with
>> substantial non-infringing uses are perfectly legal.
>
>But that only applied to FOTA material, yes? And the FCC deliberately weasled
>out on making that same right apply to MVPDs, by saying that they had no
>indication that MVPDs would PREVENT copying of that same material.
>
>Only heaven knows whether the FCC would have made an MVPD-specific ruling
>under different circumstances. A typical lawyer-like assumption is to give all
>the latitude possible to the offending party.
>
>Still, past experience has shown that CE manufacturers are blasé about any of
>this. They are more interested in not offending the Hollywood studios than
>they are in implementing Supreme Court decisions. Thing is, there are quite
>simple ways of implementing the Betamax decision correctly.
>
>Assume a strict interpretation of FCC 00-341, favoring the MVPDs.
>
>1. If you set the recorder to the cable channels, CGMS applies strictly.
>
>2. If you set the recorder to OTA freqs, CGMS codes can be interpreted at most
>to mean "copy once." Even if set to "copy never."
>
>And #2 can be further constrained, if the CE vendor feels vulnerable to
>Hollywood lawsuits. For example,
>
>a. If the recoder incorporates a hard drive, anything "copy never" (when OTA
>freqs are selected) can only be sent to the HDD.
>
>b. If the recorder does not incorporate a hard drive, anything "copy never"
>will become encrypted with a key that only THAT device can decode (when OTA
>freqs are selected). So for example, a DVD recorded from that machine can only
>be played back from that same machine.
>
>This way, you are preventing anything transmitted OTA, even with "copy never,"
>from being (easily) distributable, while at the same time, honoring the
>Betamax decision.
>
>I don't think ay of this is hard to figure out. I can't think of any valid
>excuse why this wasn't done. THEREFORE, I don't trust that this new, or
>renewed, MPAA request would be handled properly either.
>
>THEREFORE, as far as I'm concerned, the studios may continue to delay the
>broadcast of movies via MVPDs as they have done in the past, as an
>anti-pirating measure. Rather than give more latitude to studios, CE vendors,
>and broadcasters, to ignore Supreme Court decisions.
>
>Bert
>
>
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