[nvda] Re: Questions

yes you are right, but I think all ppl need to cut out the un needed bit wasting quote everything at top or bottom reply. Respect the planet ppl. Quo teeing can be useful, but it should be write and quote and snip, or second choice-quote and snip and write. This has been talked to death, and ppl on any side of this are generally not going to change. Some ppl are willing to post as the customs of the group dictate, and others won't. I do not always have time to select txt, and often leave other msgs that should be cut off dangling. I will try to be better/axing older stuff. If you just jump in, I think you should go to archive, trash bin or down-load old msgs, but if the question if minor it should not annoy the other ppl writing on the thread. The blind are and hopefully always a minority, and as such have the duty to try and adjust to certain norms. The majority should also try and adjust when it costs them nothing, to make life easier for the minority. The prob is egos which reign on the inter-net, and with out face to face checks and balances ppl tend to persist in unreasonable behaviors even more than in the non syber world. The thing that always surprises me is how helpful many folks can be here in bit-land. That is also I think a lot ego, we want to be the guy or girl that is know for helping someone else, but that is okay. Every thing is multi-faceted.

Burt
   thelli

On 11/29/2009 9:55 café, Niko Carpenter wrote:
This message is in response to Brian's post below:
Brian's mail list account wrote:
 > I got hounded of a talking newspaper list a couple of years ago as I
refused to bottom post though I offered to cut all quoted material
completely.
I think bottom posting makes sequentially more sense, but I'm not saying
people should bottom post; I'm saying they should intersperce their
messages like I'm doing now, or just completely rewrite it.

 > Some people who are sighted are, um very intolerant and not very
welcomming I find.
Most people who are sighted are not aware of the accomidations that some
blind people need, and to go on a mailing list where it is common
practice to bottom post with a bunch of sighted people, for example, and
try to change the way they do things, and you get mad when they wish to
keep their practice is intollerant in my opinion.

I understand that you feel like you are singled out as a blind person
and that since people can change to make life easier for you and they
don't, you feel upset and like people just don't care, but just try to
think of things from their perspective.

 > Its no great effort for the sighted to scroll up and down after all.
It's less of an effert for you to press control end.
 > Brian

I'm not trying to change the way people feel, and if top posting is what
people on this list prefer, I will do it because I'd rather be a part of
a great mailing list than start an argument over stupid little
indiscrepencies with the way people think. The reason I posted this was
to give those who may not be aware of it an idea of how to format
messages, so they can make their own decisions. But most importantly, I
posted it because I want blind people to realize that the world doesn't
evolve around them. There have been so many great things done for us,
and rather than just say said company is fofilling our right, or that
finally sighties realize what's happening in our world, you should be
thankful.

I do not refer to people as blindies or sighties. Being blind is part of
me, and I'm not ashamed of it, but I'm not Niko Carpenter, a member of
the blindy society, I'm just Niko, and I want everyone, blind and
sighted to accept me for simply that. We are not blindies or sighties,
we are people. The fact that I simply cannot see doesn't link me with a
certain culture or life style. It simply means that I can't see, and so
I must do things a little bit differently.

NVDA is a great tool not only for blind people but for sighted people.
For example, an IT worker at a company can use NVDA to plug a keyboard
and some headphones into a server in a big server room and not have to
worry about plugging in a monitor. It can be used for software
developers or web site designers to test accessibility on their site. We
shouldn't say that NVDA is only for the blind and sighties just don't
understand. After all, go look at the history of Braille. It did not
start with anyone who was blind.

So before you have the us vs them mentality, just think about something
for a moment: I've been asked by a lot of sighted people how I do
things. I've been asked how my Braille watch works, how my iPhone works,
how I use my computer, etc. And, I answer these questions purely in an
educational sense. These are my friends, not some otherworldy beings,
and when I tell them these things, they are extremely amaised and
interested in what I have to say. That is much better than being hostile
towards them. I'm sure there are several sighted people on this list,
and if I were one of them, I'd feel alianated and afraid to talk because
of this hostility. So before you point your fingers at people, just
remember, if you point too long, they might take notice and start
pointing back.

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