[nasional_list] [ppiindia] INDONESIA: Analysts divided on merits of Australian troops training wi
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- Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 03:15:22 +0100
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Last Updated 6/01/2006 11:19:25 AM
INDONESIA: Analysts divided on merits of Australian troops training wi
Later this month members of the Indonesian military's elite Kopassus unit will
join Australian troops for joint counter terrorism exercises in Western
Australia. The Australian Government's decision to work with Kopassus has
divided defence analysts.
Presenter/Interviewer: Paul Allen
Speakers: Gary Brown, Defence Analyst; Dr Alan Dupont, Senior fellow Lowy
Institute for International policy
ALLEN: The events in East Timor in 1999 effectively put an end to military
cooperation between Australia and Indonesia.
As Kopassus trained militia ran amok in the former Indonesian province,
Australian troops led a peacekeeping force.
But within a few weeks Kopassus soldiers are going to be training on Australian
soil .. it's something that would've been unthinkable in 1999.
A lot of water has passed under the bridge between Australia and Indonesia
since then.
The bombing of the Australian embassy in Jakarta and tourist spots in Bali has
seen the two countries work together on counter terrorism and policing.
But Canberra based defence analyst Gary Brown, says despite the efforts of the
Indonesian Government to embrace reform, it's still to soon to welcome Kopassus
back into the fold.
GARY BROWN: The present Indonesian administration is doing its level best to
inculcate democratic principles into a society that has not been terribly used
to them over the last several decades, but it has had a fair bit of success and
we should certainly be encouraging them in their endeavours. unfortunately one
of the areas that's most resistant to this kind of culture change is the
military, but of the military probably Kopassus which was at the core of the
former oppressive system is the most resistant of all, i think it's therefore
fairly unlikely and fiarly optimistic to assume that Kopassus has changed its
spots sufficiently to make it a worthy risk for cooperation.
ALLEN: Besides having a history of human rights abuses, Gary Brown is concerned
there may be people within the ranks of Kopassus who are sympathetic to
extremists and Islamic Fundamentalists.
GARY BROWN: Even a few people in an organisation like that, if intelligence we
provide goes across their desks, who can say where it will end up. It doesn't
require that the entire organisation be compromised, as anybody in the
intelligence game knows, it only takes on or two well placed people and you
have an intelligence disaster on your hands, that's the risk we run if we
cooperate in intelligence sharing with this organisation. Training might be
another matter, but intelligence sharing is I understand part of the package
and I think that's a very dangerous thing to do.
ALLEN: But Dr Alan Dupont, a senior fellow from the Lowy Institute for
International policy, is welcoming Australia's overtures to the Indonesian
military.
DR ALAN DUPONT: I do agree that Kopassus does have a fairly egregious human
rights record, I think that's generally accepted, but my arhuments are that
there are some benefits in tailored engagement with Kopassus, particularly in
the terrorist arena which is what the Government is proposing. it's not
proposing cooperation across the board, but primarily on couter terrorism, and
the reason is Kopassus has a very important role to play in the Indonesian
security system, particularly in respect to counter hijacking and so on, so I
think the Government's made the decision on pratical grounds, that if
Australians are at risk in Indonesia, we will need to have the cooperation of
Kopassus.
ALLEN: Dr Dupont also believes that just because there may be some sympathetic
elements within Kopossus and the wider Indonesian military towards Islamic
extremists, that's no reason to keep them isolated.
DR ALAN DUPONT: The Indonesian military has played a role historically of
helping Indonesia to develop a secular politic, and so it is one of the most
important institutions in my view of preventing the spread of militant Islamic
fundamentalism as it concerns all of us including many Indonesians, so if you
take the military out of the equation including Kopassus, it makes it much more
difficult I think to understand what's going on in these terrorist groups and
these radical groups to do something about it so I think that I would see the
Indonesian military not withstanding its flaws would be one of the bulwarks
against the expansion of Islamic fundamentalism in Indonesia.
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