OK, I lost the original message in this thread. Could you please lay out the steps you take to get to the clickable area so I can try it. I think I know what you need to do, but I want to see it first. Take Care John D. Panarese Director Mac for the Blind john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx http://www.macfortheblind.com AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE MAC VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:20 PM, "Julio C. Perez" <jcperez11@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Ok, so I select the "show" clickable object from within the open group and it > only switches it to a "hide" object. No additional windows open. I cant' find > any new information area with neither of the four new commands discussed so > far (cmd-tab, cmd-accent, VO-f1 or VO-f2). > On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:04 PM, John Panarese wrote: > >> If you vo space on the clickable item, try navigating right with the VO and >> right arrow keys. See if that reveals anything for you. >> >> >> Take Care >> >> John D. Panarese >> Director >> Mac for the Blind >> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >> http://www.macfortheblind.com >> >> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE >> MAC VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT >> >> >> >> On Mar 3, 2012, at 1:02 PM, "Julio C. Perez" <jcperez11@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: >> >>> Thanks John for the detailed clarification. I guess I did not get it when >>> David said it the first time. I can get back to the proper window within >>> the application by using the command-f2 twice. >>> >>> Now I can get back to the issue I started this thread with. >>> >>> So here I am in the help topic that is supposed to explain how to select >>> and deselect single and multiple items. I have here a list of clickable >>> objects that say "show" group with two items. When I interact with the >>> group, I find two clickable items within (as expected). When I click on the >>> "show" clickable, I expect to get to some text or html window that explains >>> how to do this. The only thing I seem to find is that there now appears a >>> "hide" clickable. Where do I go to find the instructions for selecting or >>> deselecting one or more items? The window chooser command only gives me the >>> "help" and "utilities" child windows. Could this have something to do with >>> the navigational mode or something? >>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:40 PM, John Panarese wrote: >>> >>>> The command-accent combination, which is the key below the escape key, >>>> will cycle you through open windows in an application. Command-tab cycles >>>> you through your open applications. For the help, try the command-accent >>>> or David's suggestion of using the window chooser menu with VO-F2 twice >>>> and then using the up and down arrows to see a list of your currently open >>>> windows. >>>> >>>> >>>> Take Care >>>> >>>> John D. Panarese >>>> Director >>>> Mac for the Blind >>>> Tel, (631) 724-4479 >>>> Email, john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com >>>> >>>> >>>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE >>>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:36 PM, George B wrote: >>>> >>>>> hummmm what is a grave key, please?? >>>>> >>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> [mailto:mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tracy Duffy >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 09:32 >>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help! >>>>> >>>>> You can also try command along with the grav key. This will move you from >>>>> window to window within an application. At least it does in Snowleopard. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:30 PM, George B wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> good job david i am not on my mac and could not remember that command >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mac4theblind- >>>>> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of David Hilbert Poehlman >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 09:27 >>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help! >>>>> >>>>> try vo-f2 twice to bring up a list of open windows. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:18 PM, Julio C. Perez wrote: >>>>> >>>>> So, when I press command-tab twice, it doesn't bring me to the >>>>> previously open help topic I left. It only switches me to the other >>>>> application windows or brings me back to the same VO utilities window. >>>>> If I go to the menu and arrow down the windows options, I only see one >>>>> applications window available to choose from. Is one of those other >>>>> options on that windows drop-down the one I need to take me back to the >>>>> topic I left? How does one switch to different windows within an >>>>> application window? >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 12:00 PM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> try command-tab twice. >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:47 AM, George B wrote: >>>>> >>>>> First of all command tab changes your application from one to another >>>>> not >>>>> windows within a application. >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: mac4theblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:mac4theblind- >>>>> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Julio C. Perez >>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2012 08:44 >>>>> To: mac4theblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> Subject: [mac4theblind] Re: help on help! >>>>> >>>>> Ok, here is an example.. >>>>> >>>>> I am currently in a help window that has . here is an even better >>>>> example of not having a clue of something that should be (and needs >>>>> to >>>>> be) understood by a neophyte. >>>>> >>>>> As I am writing this message, I switch to another window where I'm >>>>> working with a help topic. I switch back to this window to write >>>>> something and when I use the "command-tab" hoping to return to the >>>>> help >>>>> window. I end up back in the VoiceOver utilities area. Not the help >>>>> topic I thought I would be going to. How do I make this simple >>>>> switch >>>>> from one window to another without having to navigate back to the >>>>> topic >>>>> layer after linked layer? >>>>> >>>>> This is the sort of thing that I never had to think about before. >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:24 AM, David Hilbert Poehlman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> can you give us an example? I believe I know what you need to do >>>>> but >>>>> rather than searching through help for an item, it would speed up >>>>> the >>>>> process having an example. >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 3, 2012, at 11:16 AM, Julio C. Perez wrote: >>>>> >>>>> It seems like the more I think I've learned, the more I know I've >>>>> missed! >>>>> >>>>> Right now I'm going through the VoiceOver help menu seeking areas >>>>> I'm >>>>> weak on and hoping to learn more. When I get to a "show" clickable >>>>> object, I select it. and nothing seems to happen except that it >>>>> changes >>>>> from a "show" to a "hide" area. Where does the related information >>>>> get >>>>> shown? What part of this process am I not getting? >>>>> >>>>> I can freely admit that navigation and safari navigation in >>>>> particular are my weakest areas. This makes learning via the >>>>> provided >>>>> help topics slow. Does anyone know of a good tutorial for >>>>> transplanted >>>>> windows/internet explorer/JAWS users? I mean, there should be enough >>>>> of >>>>> us by now to have, at least, an email list that can serve as a place >>>>> to >>>>> trade and ask for information that might bore those of you for whom >>>>> the >>>>> mac environment is natural. >>>>> >>>>> /jp, mac user without papers!************ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any >>>>> changes to their list subscription is: >>>>> >>>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind >>>>> >>>>> The list archive is located at >>>>> >>>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/ >>>>> >>>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to: >>>>> >>>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Jonnie Appleseed >>>>> With His >>>>> Hands-On Technolog(eye)s >>>>> Touching The Internet >>>>> Reducing Technology's disabilities >>>>> One Byte At A Tie >>>>> >>>>> ************ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> You are subscribed to the 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changes to >>>> their list subscription is: >>>> >>>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind >>>> >>>> The list archive is located at >>>> >>>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/ >>>> >>>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to: >>>> >>>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>>> >>> >>> ************ >>> >>> >>> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list. >>> >>> >>> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to >>> their list subscription is: >>> >>> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind >>> >>> The list archive is located at >>> >>> //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/ >>> >>> All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to: >>> >>> john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx >>> >> >> ************ >> >> >> You are subscribed to the mac4theblind mailing list. >> >> >> The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to >> their list subscription is: >> >> //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind >> >> The list archive is located at 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The url for this list, where one can unsubscribe or make any changes to their list subscription is: //www.freelists.org/list/mac4theblind The list archive is located at //www.freelists.org/archive/mac4theblind/ All emails intended for the list owner can be sent to: john@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx