[lit-ideas] Re: global luke-warming

How do you explain it, Lawrence?



> [Original Message]
> From: Lawrence Helm <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: 4/13/2006 2:15:41 PM
> Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: global luke-warming
>
> On a related subject, or perhaps an earlier one where some here were
> imagining what it would be like after we ran out of fossil fuel in 20
years
> or so - the end of civilization as we know it or something very near - has
> everyone noticed that Brazil will become energy independent this year? 
They
> have kicked their oil addiction and have substituted ethanol:
>
http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2006-03-28-brazil-ethanol-cover_x.htm?POE=
> TECISVA .  The article indicates that the U.S. is pursuing ethanol with
> greater interest, but we are a long way behind Brazil.  Why are we so far
> behind?  I feel need of another Andreas Big-Oil conspiracy theory.  
>
>  
>
> Lawrence
>
>  
>
>  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> On Behalf Of Paul Stone
> Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2006 10:39 AM
> To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: global luke-warming
>
>  
>
> Before anyone jumps all over me as a conservative naysayer who speaks for 
>
> big oil, let me say that I am NOT denying that the consequences of
burning 
>
> copious amounts of fossil fuel are that certain things about our 
>
> environment are changing -- pollution and a very slight change in the 
>
> makeup of our atmosphere are obviously consequences.
>
>  
>
> My argument is with the varying notions of problems gathered under the 
>
> heading of "global warming" which most people don't know the definition
of, 
>
> since there really isn't a definition. My trouble is that to imply "the 
>
> planet is warming up" is deliberate misdirection for political reasons so 
>
> that people will 'take notice' of this 'global problem' which is a
doomsday 
>
> scenario in its present incarnation.
>
>  
>
> The thing is, the problem is not well defined so that lots of phenomena 
>
> that normally and naturally happen are brought under the "see, global 
>
> warming IS happening" umbrella and both snow/rain and drought, cold and 
>
> warm, ocean currents and ocean calmness,  evaporation and arid conditions 
>
> are all blamed on "global warming."
>
>  
>
>  >The WSJ editorial page is ultra conservative.
>
>  >
>
>  > And... ANY "Green" movement is ultra-liberal. Your point?
>
>  >
>
> Real quick.  Any green movement is ultra-liberal?  If you say so.
>
>  
>
> I reckon.
>
>  
>
> >Mexico City; Teheran; most of China the air is unbreathable (something
like
>
> >80% of the country)
>
>  
>
> Do you mean "unbreathable" as in 'will not sustain oxygen breathing
life"? 
>
> Or are you just hyperbolizing?
>
>  
>
> >and many places in China are actually soot covered;
>
> >India; Madison and Lex in a summer smog alert;
>
>  
>
> smog alert? You know, I used to live in a city that had regular 'smog 
>
> alerts'. On a summer day, 100 F, hazy, humid as a sauna, and the radio 
>
> would  say "there's a smog alert, don't do any strenuous exercise" blah 
>
> blah blah. Our bicycle group would meet and ride our regular 150 km with
NO 
>
> ill effects. Of course it might be dangerous for the 
>
> respiratory-challenged, but do we REALLY need to design our societies 
>
> around its illest members? Cleaning up the smog is a noble notion. I WORK 
>
> as an engineer who has as one of my primary jobs, designing systems for 
>
> scrubbing pollutants out of exhaust gases and designing waste water 
>
> treatment facilities. We achieve great results in doing this, but it's a 
>
> long process to retrofit every plant in the industrialized world. AND... 
>
> like I said, the other countries you mention are now going through what
we 
>
> already went through. They can't afford to put the blocks to their 
>
> economies just as they are building them up.  The notion that dilution is 
>
> the solution to pollution is an old one and hard to break -- Afterall,
the 
>
> world is HUGE [he said ironically] -- I think we're getting there.
>
>  
>
> >L.A. before the clean air legislation; the hundreds of Superfund sites
in 
>
> >this country, midnight
>
> >dumping just about everywhere and on and on.  There's acid rain in
Alaska, 
>
> >in Ca


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