[lit-ideas] Re: The flu

I agree that in the absence of bacterial and other infections which are som=
etimes fatal or become chronic (stomach ulcers caused by bacteria for examp=
le), very often, if not usually, the body has an amazing ability to heal it=
self.  That's the line about the cold going away in 7 days if treated and a=
 week if not treated.  The immune system is amazing in what it can do.  And=
 what it can overdo in autoimmune diseases and the like, including causing =
an inflammatory response from too much fat on the body.

There was a study a few years ago where people with knee problems had "ghos=
t" surgery, i.e., they were convinced they had surgery (scar, etc.) when in=
 fact they had not.  Those people improved just as much as the ones who had=
 actual surgery.  Likewise with Parkinson's Disease.  These people's proble=
ms were intractable before the "surgeries".  Newsweek did an entire issue o=
n the mind/body connection a few months ago. =20

While I don't dispute these authors' findings, I'm sure if they're real sci=
entists they'd be the first to say that their results have to be replicated=
 and peer reviewed before they enter the mainstream as fact.


Andy Amago





-----Original Message-----
From: Andreas Ramos <andreas@xxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Nov 28, 2004 6:49 PM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The flu

> Colds and other sickness relief is often a result of the
> placebo effect.  The placebo effect is so powerful and so
> quantitatively measurable that people with Parkinson's disease and
> knee problems have reported improvement of symptoms from placebo
> treatments.  It might be why chicken soup "works".

There is no placebo effect.

Researchers put patients with diseases in three groups: Group 1 got treatme=
nt, Group 2 got a=20
placebo, and Group 3 got nothing.

Group 2 and 3 had the same results (some got better, some got sicker). The =
placebo had no=20
effect.

The explanation is that if you get sick, most likely, you'll get better ver=
y soon anyway.=20
Most people shake off most illnesses anyway, REGARDLESS of what they do (ta=
ke chicken soup,=20
vitamin C, dance with serpents, pray to their local sun god, a shot of whis=
key, etc.) or do=20
nothing about it at all.

See the study by A. Hr=F3bjartsson & P. C. G=F6tzsche, 2001 on the placebo =
effect.

"A. Hr=F3bjartsson & P. C. G=F6tzsche found that in many studies where a co=
ntrol group was used=20
that did not get any treatment at all, the effects in the no-treatment grou=
p were almost=20
equal to the effects in the placebo group. Most studies however only use a =
placebo group as=20
control. The authors concluded that the placebo effect is overrated, and th=
at studies in the=20
future should have a no-treatment group when possible, to make sure that ef=
fects would not=20
be attributed to a placebo effect while they are totally natural effects th=
at would have=20
occurred anyway. In a follow-up study (A. Hr=F3bjartsson & P. C. G=F6tzsche=
, 2004) the same=20
authors were able to confirm their previous results and concluded: "We foun=
d no evidence of=20
a generally large effect of placebo interventions. A possible small effect =
on=20
patient-reported continuous outcomes, especially pain, could not be clearly=
 distinguished=20
from bias".

yrs,
andreas
www.andreas.com=20

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