It's 1:30 and I'm way too tired to read this thread carefully...I've only skimmed the fairly complex posts....but you guys are teetering dangerously on the edge of the question of original sin. Christianity teaches it, Judaism refutes it. I don't know about other systems of theology -- like Buddhism -- I would be interested in the Buddhist take on it. I also don't know if there is a difference between the Catholic and Protestant notions of original sin. From a Christian perspective, C. S. Lewis does a fair job of addressing the issue of evil in "Problem of Pain", and it's philosophically sound if you're working within the Christian framework. But I persist in my original thought which is that what we experience as pain or evil may not ultimately or "Really" be that .... it may be what our material being feels that it is.... but who's to say that what our physical/material/limited/flawed being experiences is the Reality or the Truth? Julie Krueger unable to express herself well at 1:30 w/ a thunderstorm (thank God! a break from ice!) in the background.