[lit-ideas] Re: The Monster is dead

It's power in its various guises that breeds monsters - perhaps it gives some 
indication of human potential.

Yet it's not the fact that Saddam was a monster that should be discussed. He 
was, and I wouldn't present an argument against the notion that he deserved the 
death penalty (unless it was couched in terms of the humanity or not of such 
penalties). Rather we should think about the utter stupidity of handing him 
over to the Shia Militia to carry out the sentence. If justice was to be served 
by such a penalty then it should have been carried out with the utmost gravity 
and impartiality. Instead we heard the executioners shouting insults and taunts.

Next we'll hear is that the US military and Bush had nothing to do with the 
proceedings: despite the fact that the US military was guarding him before and 
flew his body away after. Add to that the timing of the event - in the middle 
of the Muslim Hajj - and you have one almighty balls up.

Nice one George...
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx 
  To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Sunday, December 31, 2006 8:48 PM
  Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The Monster is dead


  Thank you.  I needed a laugh today.  You wouldn't believe the reaction I 
would get from people who know me if I told them I'd been referred to as 
Pollyanna.  If you read my post a little more clearly, I wasn't saying there 
aren't monsters out there.  I have grieved more than I care to share with the 
cyberspace world over so many monsters  -- distant, long or soon gone, and 
personal.  And I did not intend to imply that everything is cool.  I merely was 
attempting to address the cause & effect basis of your theory, wondering about 
the logic of it.  Where monster's come from is a logically fallacious reaction 
to my post.  One does not easily counter a flaw in their logic by suggesting 
that a better explanation be put forth.  I doubt the list is interested in a 
theological or philosophical dialogue on where monsters come from.  Again, that 
would not solve the problem of the chicken and the egg notion you seem to 
clutch so strongly.  The more I consider it, your position is pretty much a 
blame-game.  Another hand I've played strongly over the years.  But it rarely, 
if ever, is successful or useful.

  For whatever my two cents aren't worth,

  Julie Krueger


  <<Why am I not surprised that Pollyanna is here to tell us that what's out 
there isn't really what's out there.  After 4,000 some years of not only never 
ending war and holocausts, but increasingly lethal never ending war and 
holocausts, Pollyanna thinks everything is cool.  Maybe you can even tell us 
the Holocaust out of among countless holocausts never happened, people are just 
to good to do things like that. Yes, Polly, democracy is on the march, get 
those terrorists before they get us...  BTW, where do monsters come from?>>

    -----Original Message----- 
    From: JimKandJulieB@xxxxxxx 
    Sent: Dec 31, 2006 1:44 AM 
    To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The Monster is dead 


    <<But monsters are created by people. >>

    Irene -- 

    You're ignoring the vicious cycle part of what you have been saying for 
months.

    If monsters are created by people and people are created by people....

    c'mon.  You're smarter than that.  Either there is hope or there isn't.  
Either there is grace or there isn't.

    If there is no hope and no grace, you're barking up a useless tree.  If 
there is...... there is.

    Apparently monsters (people who are monsters) are created by people who 
seem not to have a choice in your world, and who have as their only option 
(because of their bad parenting) to parent their children badly and there is no 
hope, no escape.  Indeed, no actual beauty or joy to life unless/until the 
cycle of harm is broken; but your visage does not allow the possibility of 
grace or change or learning, of any possibility of healing.  

    For some bizarre reason I want to hum "Nothing comes from nothing, nothing 
ever could" 

    <<But monsters are created by people. >>
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