[lit-ideas] Re: Social Darwinism or Darwinian Socialism? (answers)

The seeds I'll be giving away?  What seeds?  I guess there's a point buried in 
all of this somewhere.  I picked up something about a computer.  I just got a 
19 inch flat monitor for Christmas for my desk, didn't expect it.  It's really 
nice.  I hope you got nice things for Christmas too.  


----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: 12/30/2005 2:29:55 AM 
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Social Darwinism or Darwinian Socialism? (answers)


HI,
I'll try to answer a bit...

May have to come back to this later--it's getting late for me, though!  
In a message dated 12/30/2005 12:23:16 A.M. Central Standard Time, 
What do you think of the fact (not my opinion, a fact) that the rainforests 
will be wiped off the face of the earth in 40 years,
I think of the people who are doing what they can to raise awareness.

Who do you think has focused on this--why, people who are not watching 
television or hiding in their safe little home--but people who are researching 
and studying and calling *CALLING* attention to it.  the ones who are DOING 
SOMETHING about it.

THEY are the reason I do not think that they will be wiped off the face of the 
earth.

Yes, follow the 80/20 rule here-but the story is not done yet--the last chapter 
and all that.

I put my heart and mind and energy SIDE BY SIDE with those who will call 
attention and then DO SOMETHING about making things change in our society, our 
companies, public policy, etc.

Why--you could go back to school, get a master's degree in public 
administration and begin to work on legislation with and for some of the 
organizations working on this issue!!

GET BUSY!  DO SOMETHING!  Join in with those who WILL make the changes 
necessary to stop the disappearance!  

(hey--even my son wants to buy land so that the deer who are over-running the 
roads and wrecking cars, etc. can have a place to be ...<g>  There are LOTS of 
these boys and girls coming up in this GEN Y group that you seem to think are 
all messed up...and they are practical [like Gen X] and great managers [like 
the older boomers and WWII generation] and can fuse their idealism [like the 
boomers] with those other qualities--and they WILL save the rainforest.

If you really are not going to help the rest of us, then at least do what Mikey 
said--go to sleep and wait for his wake-up call.  Just stop the whining and 
complaining--it creates darkness.

that mankind with its big brain is exterminating 50,000 species a year, and so 
on and so on? 
Again--yes. It IS a problem.  People are trying to help, but are often clueless 
in how and what they are doing. The League of Women Voters (another group you 
could very easily be involved with--and you wouldn't even have to hang out with 
kids <g> who you claim to care about but want nothing to do with...still find 
that a bit odd, but okay...) here once sponsored a very interesting discussion 
with some of the people who are involved in things like genetic engineered food 
as well as work overseas and some of the people/organizations who were upset 
with them. It was very clear that the people who work for the corps who are 
involved even inadvertently with the destruction of things like the pure forms 
of plants (they have a specific name which is escaping me--) were doing so in a 
rather clueless but well-meaning manner.  If that is so--and I do believe that 
while the TipTop people may know exactly what they are doing and the 'whys' are 
not benign--the majority of the rank and fil
 e in the companies are not 'big picture' people and once they understand the 
bit picture (and are assured that they do not have to lose their jobs if things 
change <g>--you, of all of us, should understand the need for security since 
you have high need to be safe and hidden in your cute almost mc-mansion of a 
home--

So--yes.  It's sad that it has take so long for that sort of awareness to begin 
to develop--but it has.  BUT, I do think that there are so many focused on that 
now--and even in the little ways here (what IS the name of the types of plants 
that are the original?  It's going to be bothering me all night long!), you 
could DO SOMETHING about the situation by purchasing those types of seeds and 
GIVING THEM TO PEOPLE AS A DONATION!!!

Put your money where your complaining mouth is--buy some of those and plant 
them and harvest the seeds and then give them to OTHERS.  

I guarantee you that you will be part of the solution, then.  But--complaining 
without action creates DARKNESS.  Gloom. Despair.  THAT is what you are 
creating when you don't help the rest of us...

Why do you think Israel is necessary? 
Oh, Irene.  Why is any nation necessary?  (oops sorry everyone. Did I really 
want to ask her that? <G>)  Forget that--some of it comes (I think) from the 
concepts developed during the French Revolution and nationalistic 
concepts...but that is not really the reason, in my brain anyway!

Here's a thought--and, sure--maybe a different place might have been better. 
Maybe Germany should have been cleared out and Israel have been created on top 
of Germany. Maybe that would have been more fitting of the concept of 'let the 
punishment fit the crime' or some such thing.  

But--for various reasons, Palestine was chosen. Sure, I might have done it 
differently.  (Probably would have <g>)

And, I do NOT think that the Wall that is there is doing what it was 
conjectured to do (ie keep terrorists out) mostly because the peaceful 
let-us-just-raise-our-family types are placed in situations which I would not 
like to be in [as a regular let-me-just-raise-my-family type]  I thin of that 
when I have to hit a detour on the road and end up miles out of the way--which 
has been one of outcomes of that wall. (based on what I have heard from some 
who have 'been there' and traveled through and around it...)

BUT--here is why I do think that "Israel" needs to exist. There IS prejudice 
and that prejudice, for various reasons I suppose, has often taken a horribly 
violent manner...not just the sneers that your gas station guy was given to 
doing towards Russians.

"Jews were 10 per cent of the population of the Roman Empire. If today they 
were the same proportion of the world's population that they were then, they 
would number 200 million. They number 13 million."  That was stated during a 
discussion in the Washington Post (I think--would have to double-check the 
exact reference) during Israel's 50 year anniversary of its existence.

Go ahead and argue that maybe it should have been in Germany (punishment 
fitting the crime--maybe should have moved all the Germans to Palestine then ? 
<g>  There's a story to imagine!)  

BUT--to me, there is a definite need and reason for the existence of Israel. I 
think it has 'validated' the concept of being "Jewish" as a national identity 
and that may be more of the French Revolution thing, but it still has had the 
result that Jews are still a People. (Kind of like how even though reservations 
for the Native Americans here in the USA are not what they should have been 
created to be and do--but it is true that without them, they would not have, 
still, their tribal heritage and the sense that they are A People...and while 
one can discuss [as we have] the merits of learning about various cultures--and 
I do think it is healthy even if you are a potpourri of races <g>--I do think 
that knowing and having 'roots' and a 'place' is important and healthy and 
Constructive.


Why do you think Napoleon is synonymous with victory instead of murder?  

Hm  Is he?  I am not sure that *for everyone* that this is true.  Most people 
that I know of when asked (as in the game where you hear a term and then name 
the first thing that comes to mind) about Napoleon will think of his dying 
alone on an island--bereft of friends and family.  Lonely and Alone--those are 
the terms that are synonymous in my world with Napoleon.  Neither 'victory' nor 
'murder'.  

Interesting, no?  Remember--you don't hang out with People much <g> so maybe on 
television he is synonymous with victory and that bothers you... but perhaps if 
you actually talked to PEOPLE instead of imagining what they are thinking, 
you'd have some very interesting discussions.

(Still think you need to attend a Unitarian Church...full of discussion there 
and though most are doers--they are definitely thinkers, too!)  

What do you think of my analogy that if a dog had as much food as would fit 
into a McMansion and still needed to take other dogs' daily rations, we'd think 
he was sick, but when people do it, we bow down to greatness. 

Hey--YOU are the one in (to use your term) an 'almost McMansion, not me!  

But--I DO know some people who are in homes that are close to McMansions 
(probably in homes like yours, maybe?)  <g>  as well, I know some extremely 
wealthy people (just found out about one set of those the other day--would 
NEVER have guessed...though it explains their incredible generousity...)

Most of the people that *I* know who are in awesome homes are also very giving 
and caring people.

Now--granted, you don't much like people or kids--and you don't like to get out 
much, so you don't really have any way of knowing what LOTS of people are like 
who have lots of money.

It's all relative, isn't it?  I mean--there you are with a nice home and yet, 
when I suggested that you use some of that room to help some others who would 
be ever so grateful for that assistance--you backed away pretty fast.

So, what do I think?  I think that you think you are a nice person simply 
because you are not taking more than what you already have... (well, but we 
really don't know, do we? After all...didn't know your name, either! <wry look>)

BUT--you certainly could have purchased a smaller home so you wouldn't be using 
up so much land, right?  (I only say that since you are the one screaming about 
the environment...)

You could have bought a lot and then built a teeny tiny house just big enough 
for you and your husband to stay in and then set aside the rest of the lot for 
wildlife and such.   [does not sound like you have too many houseguests so one 
bedroom should be plenty--maybe a teeeny tiny den...just big enough for a 
computer since you say you need one...though a laptop should be sufficient, 
no?)  

BUT--that is just to say that you do seem to be describing yourself!

I am not sure, if you were/are a giving sort, that living in a home that is 
teeny tiny is necessarily what is best.

One of the most breath-taking homes I have ever been in is "North of the River" 
in my area--and each floor (there are, I think, four) is about 10,000 sq ft.  
It was built by one of the wealthiest and giving families in our area.  It was 
built that way because, when it was built, there was NO PLACE in that part of 
the Northland (which has two counties)  for a large gathering of people for any 
charitable organization to come together.  There is now--a very nice community 
college and some other spots--but for years upon years, they would open their 
home (except for a few rooms) and organizations could use their home for 
events. 

In addition, sometimes it is exactly what is needed for people who are walking 
up a Path to see what is possible.  Or, as one of my friends said--he didn't 
mind working hard to help someone else succeed as long as he got a part of it 
so that he could take care of his family.

I had that discussion with my two acquaintances today -- the single moms -- who 
are going through rough times right now.  They were trying to figure out how 
the new year could get better--saw no hope.  So, I gave them some--and shared a 
couple of things that I have happening which may create some good...and, as 
they know, I'll share...and they are on my share/care list...

My siblings, a couple have a lot of money, are extremely generous.  Extremely.  
(kind of hard for one of the spouses, but hey--personal growth means learning 
to trust, too...)  Love going to their homes--beautiful.  One is like walking 
into a museum...but it is SO great to be in a home like that--and that family 
shares.

Why not want ALL of us, every single person, to live in a charming home?  It's 
one reason Habitat for Humanity is so important with what they do. And, I sure 
wish you'd help them out!

I think I know lots of different sorts of people than you do...but since you 
don't get out much in your world, I would suspect that you have no idea who in 
your area and are living in the McMansions are the sharing/caring/DOING 
sorts...  For all you know, they are the ones funding the local Habitat for 
Humanity in your area...

I grant you, though--the ones who do not DO and who see the need--well, I don't 
call them great.  I don't even call them 'sick'.  If I were into judging, I 
suppose I'd use Selfish.  Mean.  But I'd prefer to just hope that they are in a 
mode whereby they will awaken and begin DOING and SHARING--and simply need to 
know that it is 'okay' to do so!

Like you, in a way...hmmm? <g>
  
 Essentially, Marlena, humans pat themselves on the back for being barbarians 
and priding themselves on acting like dogs. 

If all people were like my Sparky, they would be DOING <g> (for sure!) and 
FRIENDLY and LOVING and CARING (and not really empathetic, but definitely 
sympathetic in a DOING say--he ALWAYS is there to comfort if any are upset!)

 Humans are so proud to be a species that lights an occasional candle in the 
darkness, and it never occurs to them that maybe if they'd stop creating the 
darkness they could have a lot more light.

Or, maybe...if the humans who whine about the darkness would join in the rest 
of us, the darkness WOULD disappear--for *I* am (hopefully) not creating 
darkness--and I know that if you lit a candle that your corner of the world 
would be much brighter.

If you would transmute your energy for complaining into action to DO something 
about it!  Wow!

I'm telling you, Irene, your energy is strong stuff.  Your candle would not be 
little.  It would be BRIGHT.

LIGHT IT!!

hoping to hear about those seeds Irene will be giving away...(what IS their 
name...?)
Best,
Marlena in Missouri

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