[lit-ideas] Re: SOS or Charles Taylor's Sources of the Self
- From: "Andy Amago" <aamago@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 09:47:56 -0400
> [Original Message]
> From: Omar Kusturica <omarkusto@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Date: 5/19/2006 9:28:02 AM
> Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: SOS or Charles Taylor's Sources of the Self
>
>
>
> --- Andy Amago <aamago@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> > > [Original Message]
> > > From: Robert Paul <rpaul@xxxxxxxx>
> > > To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > Date: 5/19/2006 3:48:05 AM
> > > Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: SOS or Charles Taylor's
> > Sources of the Self
> > >
> > >
> > > The procedures you describe might well be the
> > beginning of teaching
> > > English to those who don't know it; but they'd
> > also be the beginning of
> > > teaching words to those who do know it. That is to
> > say, it's about what
> > > one would expect in ordinary conversation between
> > those who do and those
> > > who don't know the meanings of particular English
> > words*. What's clearly
> > > missing is what I took you to be asking Taylor
> > for, namely, a precise
> > > (or 'formal') definition of anything.
> >
> >
> > Very busy but can't resist, and if I misunderstand
> > your point, then
> > apologies. Teaching English, or any language, to
> > those who don't know it,
> > has nothing to do with definition. It's
> > translation.
>
> *Well, no it isn't necessarily. You could also miss an
> opportunity to pontificate about things you know
> little about on occasion. I don't speak too much
> Chinese and I try to avoid using in class even what I
> do know because it's not very helpful. I haven't
> exactly invented the "direct approach" to language
> teaching, either.
>
Except that you forget that I'm bilingual, so I speak from experience.
Translation may sound easy, but it's extremely difficult (there's a lot of
junk translation out there; that doesn't count). Translating is learning
to think in another language. I defy anyone to learn the Cyrillic
alphabet, get a dictionary and then make heads or tails of anything on
BBCRussian.com, or even in a kid's book. I'm not underestimating your, or
my, abilities. It's a profound undertaking for those who can do it well.
Being bilingual, truly bilingual where one can think in two languages is,
well, my usual pontificating self is at a loss for English words. I said
it's like poetry. In fact, a while back I wrote up the following, never
sent it. I don't have time to edit, so I'm pasting it as I wrote it and
forgot about it, but it may give you an idea of what I am talking about:
I'm reading my translator's forum (I am NOT a translator; it's just a
hobby). Every time I go into this site, I think, I can't do that. It's
very daunting, and it's very subjective. This is an example of a sentence
that someone is asking for help with. Look at all the ways this sentence
is translated by different people. Some (most) don't even make sense. It
amazes me that people get a few months training and then they go and
research archives or otherwise "communicate" with the locals or do whatever
they do. No wonder everybody hates each other. I have no idea what these
sentences mean in English. I'm tempted to say "the lounge on first floor
of the administration building" but who knows? There's no context, so that
doesn't help.
"ground floor welfare rooms in administration building"
"amenity room (or accommodation space) of the ground floor of common
building"
"Ground Floor Utility Rooms of Amenities Block"
"utility space on the ground/first-floor of the amenity building "
"Utility space in... of the Outbuilding"
So, Omar please understand that I am not underestimating translating. In
fact, I would raise it from skill to, properly done, almost an art. The
people who came up with the above are clearly not artists.
> O.K.
>
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