Andrey, Russian seems to be a very odd language. Why have a soft "t" in the language when the 24th letter of the Russian alphabet is exactly the same sound/phoneme: "ts" as in "tsar" or "tsapnul" (snapped)? It's written like the Englisch "u" with a squiggle at the bottom right side. I thought the Soviets eliminated all forms of redundancy from the culture and governement. Also odd is that there is a soft "r" in Russian (as in "tsar" but not "rabota" or "razboynik") but it is not marked in the language by either a soft sign or any other marker. Any hypotheses? Aren't languages supposed to be logical semantic and syntactic frameworks? Like Phoenix, AZ? Strana Mariyevana, chay pila a puza holodnaya. Do all Russian infinitives end with a soft "t"? Valodsya von Odessa On Tue, 29 Aug 2006, Andy Amago wrote: > The 't' in nyet is distinctly hard. The 't' in mat' (mother) is distinctly > soft. So soft, in fact, that it's followed by a soft sign, transliterated > with an apostrophe: mat'. Ubit' is followed by a soft sign, because it's > an infinitive. It's therefore a soft 't'. > > > > > [Original Message] > > From: <wokshevs@xxxxxx> > > To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; Mike Geary <atlas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > Date: 8/29/2006 2:51:45 PM > > Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Movie > > > > Gospodsi bozhimoy, pomiluy nas! There's obviously only one Russian ear on > this > > List. (Yes, I'm deaf in one ear.) None of the offered hypotheses on > phonetics > > or transliteration are correct. There is no soft "t" in Russian, there is > only > > one "t," as in "Tanya" or "Toronto." The purportedly soft "t" is a > completely > > different letter. And that is the letter in the Russian infinitive "to > kill." > > (And we won't even mention the Russian soft "r" as in "tsarina.") > > > > Valodsya Akshevsky > > Zhivago Chair of Translation and Interpretation Sciences > > University of Lower Odessa, Rossia > > > > Quoting Mike Geary <atlas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>: > > > > > > For Paul, tsar is closer to the pronunciation. It's ts like the ts > in tsk > > > > tsk, with a soft rolled r at the end. > > > > > > > > > Interesting. I've always wondered how to pronounce "tsk tsk." You > seem to > > > say it's /ts, ts/. Almost all the dictionaries I've consulted say the > > > pronunciation is /tisk tisk/. I've never ever heard anyone say "tisk > tisk" > > > in disapproval or in any other circumstance. Nor have I ever heard /ts > ts/. > > > > > > I have often heard people make a sound of disapproval by quickly > withdrawing > > > > > > their tongue from their upper gum ridge which produces a sucking > liquidy > > > sound -- almost a /th/ sound in reverse. Are there people who really > say > > > "tisk tisk"? Or is that just the orthographic convention for the > reverse > > > th? > > > > > > Mike Geary > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Andy Amago" <aamago@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > To: "lit-ideas" <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > Sent: Monday, August 28, 2006 3:50 PM > > > Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Movie > > > > > > > > > >I heard him interviewed. He's basically says nothing with power point > > > > razzle dazzle. Better than bad news all the time I guess. > > > > > > > > As far as self mastery, I never said self mastery. That's > antithetical to > > > > everything I believe in. I believe in expressing emotions but doing > it > > > > such that no one gets hurt (certainly not to include war or > variations on > > > > war) and far from the madding crowd. The point is training the > emotions > > > > through appropriate expression, not mastery. Self mastery sounds to > me > > > > like turning one's self into a pressure cooker. Good luck. > > > > > > > > For Julie, yeah, we do live in a three dimensional world but we have > two > > > > dimensional brains. The tension between those states results in war, > > > > persecution, etc. > > > > > > > Russia never had a king, only tsars. > > > > Tsar (alternatively czar, csar, tzar) is derivative of Caesar. > > > > > > > > Eric, check this out. Everything's hunky dory in Iraq, except the > Shiite > > > > militias are fighting the Iraqi troops, otherwise known as the > government. > > > > Think that sounds like civil war? Nah, I didn't think so. > > > > > > > > http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/5293278.stm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> [Original Message] > > > >> From: Eric Yost <eyost1132@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > >> To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > >> Date: 8/28/2006 1:38:50 PM > > > >> Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Movie > > > >> > > > >> Irene: We replay on this list what happened; reality is > > > >> reported to you, you get mad not at the reality or the > > > >> perpetrator of the reality, but at the messenger. > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> Obviously I don't believe you are reporting reality, but a > > > >> sort of alarmist fiction that admits no correction. You may > > > >> think I am also fabulating just as stubbornly. However, you > > > >> seem to linger on past policy mistakes, rather than look > > > >> forward to new developments, in support of your view that > > > >> the sky is falling. > > > >> > > > >> Try reading _The Pentagon's New Map_ by Thomas P.M. Barnett, > > > >> for a less alarmist take on events. He's pro-globalism and > > > >> uses an information paradigm, probably has other limitations > > > >> I'm not aware of, but his is a refreshing perspective. You > > > >> can buy his book here: > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0399151753/104-6947401-6419119?v=glance&n=2 > > > > 83155 > > > >> > > > >> ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > >> To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > > > >> digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > > > > digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > > > digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > > digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, > digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html > ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html