[lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot

  • From: "Simon Ward" <sedward@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:16:19 -0000

1. Lawrence, exhibiting flawless debating capabilities, causes Simon to crash 
and burn.

2. Lawrence, citing disinterest, leaves the discussion before it gets too 
dangerous. 

Choice of two. Difficult I know.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Lawrence Helm 
  To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 11:08 PM
  Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot


  I haven't been following it in the paper either.  I thought there was an 
Iraqi trial.  I thought there were an Iraqi Judge and an Iraqi Jury.  I thought 
the U.S. had turned Saddam over to the Iraqis.  That's what I got from the 
headlines I scanned.  You seem awfully excited about this and I don't know why 
- not that I'm terribly interested - don't get the wrong idea.  Leftists seem 
able to make "one almighty balls up" out of almost anything.  Yawn.

   

  What do the actuarial tables have to say about brutal dictators?  I wonder 
how many of them spend their golden years beneath the leaves of their own fig 
tree.  

   

  I dug my newspaper out of the trash and read the captions under the photos of 
happy Iraqis.  Good stuff.  I like happy Iraqis.  

   

  Lawrence

   


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  From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On Behalf Of Simon Ward
  Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 2:51 PM
  To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot

   

  Since you haven't read previous posts, let me copy and paste what I said 
earlier. Perhaps it'll do as a starter.

   

  "...it's not the fact that Saddam was a monster that should be discussed. He 
was, and I wouldn't present an argument against the notion that he deserved the 
death penalty (unless it was couched in terms of the humanity or not of such 
penalties). Rather we should think about the utter stupidity of handing him 
over to the Shia Militia to carry out the sentence. If justice was to be served 
by such a penalty then it should have been carried out with the utmost gravity 
and impartiality. Instead we heard the executioners shouting insults and taunts.

   

  Next we'll hear is that the US military and Bush had nothing to do with the 
proceedings: despite the fact that the US military was guarding him before and 
flew his body away after. Add to that the timing of the event - in the middle 
of the Muslim Hajj - and you have one almighty balls up."

   

  Simon

    ----- Original Message ----- 

    From: Lawrence Helm 

    To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 

    Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 10:30 PM

    Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot

     

    I haven't been following your "Saddam" discussions.  Since you are implying 
in your note below that his execution was a mistake, I might assume you are 
logically (if you were inclined toward being logical; which you demonstrably 
are not) consistent with your earlier leftist (and non-Liberal) assertions that 
it would have been preferable to leave this brutal dictator in place.  As to 
his execution, I believe the Iraqis did that.  Are you saying they shouldn't 
have?  Based upon what?  Your opposition to the Death penalty?  Your admiration 
of Dictators in general and this one in particular?  Too soon to give the 
Iraqis the right to come to their own conclusions about him? 

     

    Doesn't sound like an interesting subject.  But of course I made that 
determination some time ago when I elected not to read any of the messages.

     

    Lawrence

     


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    From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Simon Ward
    Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 2:02 PM
    To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
    Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot

     

    So that's a no for Saddam's demise then?

     

    Too difficult to defend? Too embarrassing a mistake? Or do you like the 
notion of raw revenge and how that will enrage the Arab and Muslim world?

      ----- Original Message ----- 

      From: Lawrence Helm 

      To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 

      Sent: Monday, January 01, 2007 9:55 PM

      Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Max Boot

       

      Simon writes, As for my [lack of] success in debates with Lawrence, 
memory suggests that it has been him either using dodgy debating tactics [like 
using logic] or else just plain leaving rather than me on the fire and burn.  

       

      Right, well I do confess to "just plain leaving" after you demonstrated 
not only a lack of understanding of the rules of logic but an insistence that 
logic should be ignored in order to allow the debate to continue.  

       

      Lawrence

       


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