[lit-ideas] Re: Kamikaze versus 9/11 Terrorists
- From: Robert Paul <robert.paul@xxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2006 20:09:52 -0800
In The Greeks and the Irrational, the classicist E. R. Dodds, who was an
amateur Freudian, distinguished between an earlier 'shame culture,' and
a later, more 'modern' guilt culture. The Greeks… was published in 1951;
I'm sure many on the list know it. The notion that there was such a
transition in Greek morality and practice is also discussed by A. W. H.
Adkins, in Merit and Responsibility, 1960.
This about 'shame culture' from
http://www.anistor.co.hol.gr/english/enback/e024.htm
Archaic and even classical Greeks lived in what has been termed a
"shame-culture" where the greatest moral wrong was public disgrace, as
opposed to the private knowledge that one had done wrong (Dodds 1951
28-63; Adkins 151-171). In fact, there were no private wrongs. As
Alister MacIntyre explains in After Virtue "morality and social
structure are in fact one and the same in heroic society (116)." This is
to say that to possess status and reputation is to be good, and to not
have these is to be bad. The word for a noble, the agathos, actually
meant good, as the word for one of lower class, kakos, meant bad. In a
shame-culture the only moral evil is failure to live up to one’s status,
and the only moral sanction is a reduction in status. In such a world,
any failure of others to acknowledge the rightful status of an
individual is a great slight that demands retribution. The "anger of
Achilles" which is the subject of the Iliad is prompted by the highly
public slight of Achilles by Agamemnon, a slight that causes him to
withdraw from the battle. Why fight and die if one would not be honored
for it? The warrior fights for the sake of honor and remembrance, not
because his cause is "right" in any abstract moral sense.
[By David Hoffman, who seems to accept the shame/guilt division more or
less without question.]
Robert Paul
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