Alan: I am going to put my two cents worth in on this one. Yes, personal computers are a valuable tool for blind persons. HOWEVER, they are completely useless unless you have screen reader software, such as JAWS, MAGIC or others like them. And to date, I have not found an independant software that can be installed to utilize a scanner that will effectively read mathematical equations. And to make matters worse, these software applications are priced so far out of reach for people who have no governmental counselor, such as The Department of Assistive and Rehabilitative Services (DARS). For someone who is in training, or re-training, to enter the workforce, and they do not have the financial means to purchase such products, what is the alternative BUT to rely on such governmental assistance. If there is a product that does work with multifunction units (fax/scan/print/copy) for reading mathematical text, please let me know of it. Jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: Alan Dicey To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 9:55 AM Subject: the Personal Computer was the greatest thing ever invented for the Blind Dear Cy, I respectfully disagree with you! I am sure the Personal Computer was the greatest thing invented to assist the Blind so far! It will read anything also! And it allows Blind to perform work as fast if not faster than Sighted people. With Best Regards, Alan Miami, Florida Alan Dicey, President United States Braille Chess Association - USBCA "Yes, Blind or Visually Impaired People Can, and Do, Play Chess!!!" United States Braille Chess Association Home Page: http://AmericanBlindChess.org ----- Original Message ----- From: Cy Selfridge To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2010 10:37 AM Subject: RE: One or two spaces The Optacon was the single greatest invention of all times for a blind person. It is the only device which would allow a blind person to read almost anything printed. Cy, The anasazi From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Dave Durber Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 6:32 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: One or two spaces As an Optacon user, (Remember that useful gadget), to read books, I notice that the amount of space between sentences still seems to be the equivalent of two spaces. There is a feature in Word that will create the equivalent amount of space between sentences as if you had pressed the SPACE BAR twice. You can have word do the same thing between paragraphs but with the equivalent amount of space between paragraphs as if you had pressed the ENTER key twice. I have not used these functions personally, this is because I have no trust in a Microsoft product to do always what it claims to do. Oh, dear me, untrusting cynic that I am. So, being as I am becoming an old fuddy duddy,, I will go on tapping the SPACE BAR twice between sentences and tapping the ENTER key twice to put a blank line to insert a blank line between paragraphs and before and after headings. HTH Sincerely: Dave Durber ----- Original Message ----- From: CrisMunoz54 To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 5:36 PM Subject: RE: One or two spaces Two spaces are from the days of the typewriter. Go one space. It'll look better. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Adrian Spratt Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 2:33 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: One or two spaces Hi, John. Just to save anyone a duplication of effort, this Wikipedia link is to the same article as the one given to us by G.W. Cox. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of john R. Vaughn Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 4:57 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: One or two spaces Adrian and list, interesting issue of whether to single or double space after the terminal punctuation for a sentence and the beginning of the next sentence. Believe it or not, the link below is from wicipedia on the matter and I found this from doing a google search. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentence_spacing#History As for me, always a double space bar between sentences, I am going to try the one space bar and and have sighted folks tell me if the MS Word program does infact do some sort of variable spacing to clearly indicate the end of one sentence and another. John -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Adrian Spratt Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 2:04 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: please help Hi, Richard. You couch your argument in terms of blind computer users making sure their work looks as polished as our sighted colleagues. I agree with this concept, but you do it a disservice by flatly asserting that double spaces meet that objective. I was persuaded to switch to single spaces while using word processors by several sighted people who observed too much space at the ends of my sentences and by a man who has published the two standard texts on typesetting and typeset conventions. There may be special circumstances, such as the tab issue brought up by Ted Lisle, but the Wikipedia entry to which G.W. Cox sent a link lays out the history and current general preference. This is one of those questions that is very hard for us to grasp because the impact is purely visual. Unsupported, strongly worded assertions don't help. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Richard P. Kelly Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 10:14 AM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: please help Greetings all, Proper formatting of a print document still calls for two spaces at the end of a sentence, after a colon, and perhaps elsewhere. This remains true even with mono spaced or proportionally spaced fonts. New word processors often assure proper style is used if auto correct and grammar checking is on. Still, we want what we print to look as polished as what our sighted colleagues produce; if not better! Cordially, Richard P. Kelly rpkelly@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx rich@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.new-visions-network.com From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Lisle, Ted (CHFS DMS) Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2010 6:50 AM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: please help Now that's interesting. I Have seen one space from time to time, but never knew why. I sometimes long for the days of Pica and Elite, when laying out a document. In the immortal words of Edith Bunker, "You knew where you were then." However, I've managed to figure out which font-size combinations are functional equivalents of the old Pica, 10-space-per-horozontal-inch, format, and that's what I use. Vertical spacing will have to look after itself. Ted From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Adrian Spratt Sent: Monday, October 18, 2010 6:37 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: RE: please help I preface this suggestion by acknowledging there's a debate about whether there should be one or two spaces after the end of a sentence. Despite my pre-computer typing training, I have been convinced that modern print fonts mean that two spaces are no longer desirable. So the way I solve the problem you describe is to search for two spaces and replace with one space. If you think there might be an odd number of spaces, say three, then search for that number first and replace with a single space. Then search for all instances of a double space and replace with that single space. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Hina Sent: Monday, October 18, 2010 6:24 PM To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: please help hi, i am writing a lots of reports and i did figure out formatting issues, but i am not sure how will i know if there are extra spaces between words, sentenses and paragraphs without reading word by word which is so time consuming? for sighted people, microsoft word highlights but is there any way to know with jaws? microsoft's spell checke option says that there is extra space and suppose to change it to make corrections, but they still remain and is there a way to deal with this issue with jaws? i would be very thankful for your help. hina. __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 5545 (20101019) __________ The message was checked by ESET Smart Security. http://www.eset.com