Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window interface and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
- From: "Steve Gomes" <finnygomes@xxxxxxx>
- To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2006 19:21:37 -0700
the trouble with you yard bird is you keep going on and on and on like a broken
record. First you ask a question. then someone answers it. then you thank them
and ask for more clarification. then you tell them a better way of explaining
it. then you thank them again and come up with yet another way of explaining
it. and you know what? it gets really old. Since the moderator will not stop
you I will just hit the delete key every time I hear yard bird.
my web site
www.11954.com/gomes
phone 720-747-4990
----- Original Message -----
From: Yardbird
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 7:08 PM
Subject: Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window interface
and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Dear Mr. Gomez,
Thank you very much for your contribution. I'm sorry to inconvenience you.
I'm not certain how you know that others are also bored, as you sayyou are, but
I hope that someone besides me may gain from this exchange a clear idea of what
things are called accurately. To help us help each other. I am not trying to
conduct a private discussion. I'm very sorry if you thought I was.
I recommend you delete messages with this subject line if you're no longer
interested in it. That should lessen your distress. I hope this is helpful
new infromation for you. I'm sure you have a lot to teach me, also. That's
what makes this list so terrific.
Again, thanks very much for your thoughtful comment.
----- Original Message -----
From: Steve Gomes
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 5:57 PM
Subject: Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window interface
and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
why don't you have your discussion so we don't have to be borred with it
my web site
www.11954.com/gomes
phone 720-747-4990
----- Original Message -----
From: Yardbird
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window
interface and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Chris,
Okay. Here's the easy way to figure out if we're talking about the same
thing. I'll list the menu options that are listed when I press Insert J ("Jaws
context menu") while composing this message, and then I'll list the items on
the Windows Context Menu that I'll bring up by pressing the Windows context key
("applications key") immediately to the left of the right Control key. After
closing the Insert J menu by hitting Escape, of course.
First, Insert J:
Options,Options, Utilities, Languages, Help, About. Same as the menu line
in the Jaws screen I never see because I have Jaws running running from the
system tray. But as far as I can tell, it's the same as the Jaws screen
without the big open rectangular design. Nothing more. And not
context-responsive or context-variable..
Now I'll press the Windows context key(which is officially called the
"applications" key)and list the menu items that come up:
cut, copy, paste, select all,font, paragraph, increase indent, decrease
indent properties.
Now that's what I'm accustomed to usually hearing referred to as a "context
key," no matter what Windows calls it. and it has nothing at all to do with
Jaws.
As you can see, the "Jaws context" key is quite different, and doesn't vary
in its offerings depending on whether you're in an open email you're composing,
or at the Google site, or in Word.
Hope that helps. someone is calling these things differently. And that's
all this is about. Don't you think so? Please remember, I use both these
things all the time and don't have any problem regarding them at all. I awes
just trying to figure out what someone was talking about.
thank you.
I hope that's clearer, in regard to what these things mean to me. Thanks
very much.
----- Original Message -----
From: Yardbird
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 2:40 PM
Subject: Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window
interface and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Chris,
I'm afraid I'm unsure again what you mean, to my surprise. first of all,
please understand that I know generally what a context menu is. Shift f10, or
right click, or the key immediately to the left of the right control key
brings that sort of thing up. Okay? But you guys were referring to the "Jaws
context key," all along, and so I thought you meant (and maybe someone even
wrote, here) the Insert J key combo.
Now, to start off with, I could swear I asked "Insert J is a context menu
key?I thought it just put up something like the Jaws menus. that's all I ever
get it to do.
Then everyone, and you, explained (and what I heard when I paid attention
upon keying Insert J, too) said that this was a special Jaws context key unlike
anything other programs have. You said it brings up what's essentially nothing
but a list of menu headings, and not any other feature of a program interface.
You said, moreover, that if I were to press this key combo in different
situations, its menu items would change accordingly. I said, oh, I'd never
noticed that happening.
Anyway, now are you saying that you've been talking about simply using a
general context menu commands such as Shift f10, right click, or the context
menu key on the right side of the space bar? You aren't talking about Insert
J? Than all that was for nothing, I guess. Of course I know what it is to
bring up a context menu in the normal Windows way.
Do you see what's going on? At this point, I don't anymore. Could it
possibly be that the first person to mention the "Jaws context key" that got me
asking in the first place actually meant "the context key when you happen to be
*in* jaws?" Or something like that? And then called it the Jaws context key,
just as if I pressed Shift f10 while in Word, and began referring to that as
the Word context key combination?
Arghh.
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Jenkins
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 1:57 PM
Subject: RE: description of the difference between the Jaws window
interface and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Hello Daniel.
Sorry for the confusion. When I was describing a context menu I was not
speaking of "insert + J" instead I was speaking of a normal context menu
that you would access via the "shift + F10" are the applications key. You
can find the applications key one key to the left of the right control key
on a full-size keyboard. If you open the context menu in this message your
choices will be different than if you open the context menu while focused on
a list of messages from within your inbox.
I hope this helps.
Chris.
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Yardbird
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 2:41 PM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: description of the difference between the Jaws window interface
and the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Chris,
Most of your explanation helps a lot, although parts of it are stuff I
already know. What's helpful though is important.
I'm partially sighted too, and have noticed that the Jaws Context Menu is
displayed as you describe, as a vertical list, like a menu (of course). And
I of course know that if I hit escape, it disappears. But it has always
seemed so similar to me in its menu titles that I suspected it was just a
vertical rendering of the Jaws screen.
Now, I haven't used Jaws except in the system tray for a few years, so it's
been a long time since I last actually, literally saw the Jaws screen
itself. But I remember it just as you describe it, in other words, looking
like almost any standard Windows program interface; only because my central
retinal area is totally decimated, I never did see the image of a shark
within the rectangle. Cute touch. Thanks for telling me. And I know of
course that you have to either exit Jaws or cycle out of it to another
application in order to get away from that display. No confusion there.
So it was just the similarity of the menu items that confused me and made me
suspect that the context menu was just some clear vertical version of the
regular Jaws screen, and not actually a context menu. I thought that must
be some sort of labeling mistake that no one thought important enough to
rectify. I know, that sounds goofy now, but that's what I thought. Also, I
never happen to have experienced finding the menu title and/;or options
different from context to context when I've brought up that Insert J thing,
for some reason. Maybe I'd have to go deeper into its menu structures to
become aware of such variability. But I never have had to go that deeply
into one or the other of the menus, whose titles seem to remain the same
(maybe I'm wrong, but I've never noticed the menu titles changing).
So, after all that, now I feel that I truly get what the difference is
between one and the other, and I hope you aren't completely exhausted for
the day because of having taken the time to run down the details like that.
As I say, I understood already a couple of ordinary things in the
explanation, but not some simple but essential things that others spoke of
too abstractly for me to feel confident that I knew what was meant.
Many thanks,
Daniel
tun----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Jenkins <mailto:saveup@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 11:02 AM
Subject: description of the difference between the Jaws window interface and
the Jaws context menu interface for Jaws for Windows.
Hello Daniel.
First of all let me say I'm not totally blind. But I still depend on Jaws
for Windows to be able to use the computer.
I'm going to describe the Jaws window interface of Jaws for Windows first
and then I will describe the Jaws context menu interface. The Jaws window
has a title bar, a menu bar and a status line. All of this is contained in
a rectangular window with a picture of a shark in the center of the window.
On the other hand when Jaws is ran from the system tray I have a picture of
a shark in the system tray. You can verify this by bringing up the list of
items in the system tray by pressing "insert + F11" and you should see Jaws
for Windows in the list of items. If you press enter on this item you will
get the same context menu as you would get by pressing "insert + J". You
are correct this context menu has the same menu choices as you will find in
the Jaws window interface. Your choices are in a vertical list with
submenus for a lot of the choices. If you press escape out of the context
menu you will no longer be in the Jaws interface. On the other hand if you
escape out of the menus while using the Jaws window interface you will still
be in the Jaws window. If you are using the Jaws window interface and you
press "insert + page down" the status line will be spoken. I think you will
hear your version number and your serial number in the status line of the
Jaws window.
Don't forget a context menu will have different choices depending on what
you're doing. For example if you press your applications key while in this
message. It will bring up a different context menu than if you press your
application key while focused on a list of messages in your inbox.
I hope this helps.
Chris.
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Yardbird
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 12:18 PM
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: changing language situation
hello Chris,
I do in fact have Jaws running from my system tray, launching at startup.
And I use this insert J command regularly. However, even though Jaws
clearly announces "context menu" when I invoke it, for some reason I've
tended to ignore this announcement because what that brings up appears to be
very much like a replica of the Jaws interface I'm familiar with if I happen
not to be running Jaws in the system tray, which I think of as the Jaws
interface, just as if it were the interface of some other program. This
"context menu" appears to have main entries that are, in fact, nothing but
the same menu headings which appear along the menu line of the Jaws
interface. Except that you don't have to bother pressing the alt key to go
to the menu line. You see what I' mean? So I've always imagined it was just
a way to bring up the Jaws main screen (that's what I mean by "interface")
when it wasn't always there to cycle to in the task bar. That's all I
thought was invoked by Insert J.
And you know, I'm not sure I'm wrong, even now. All that would convince me
would be if I had someone with normal vision look at what's onscreen when I
have jaws in the Task Bar, then reset Jaws to run in the system tray,
reboot, and see if the display in fact just looks as if you've brought up
the main Jaws screen with a hotkey.
anyway, had I ever allowed myself to register hearing "context menu" as I
pressed Insert J, I'd have known that's what it's called by FS, whether
frivolously or more seriously.
Thanks for explaining,
Daniel
----- Original Message -----
From: Chris Jenkins <mailto:saveup@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 5:28 PM
Subject: RE: changing language situation
Hello Daniel.
She forgot that not everyone has Jaws to start in the system tray. When you
have Jaws starting from the system tray with insert + J a context menu
appears which contains all of the options in this context menu. If you are
using the Jaws window interface go to the menu bar, press right arrow until
you hear language, open the language menu, press down arrow until you hear
synthesizer language submenu and open the submenu where you should see the
list of speech synthesizer languages. Make sure and be using eloquence as
your speech synthesizer while doing this.
I hope this helps.
Chris.
-----Original Message-----
From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Yardbird
Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 7:41 PM
To: JFW List
Subject: Re: changing language situation
Hi,
What menu is it that you're referring to as the Jaws context menu? One of
the menus in the Jaws interface (not meaning Configuration manager, but the
basic Jaws screen)? Or do you mean something to do with the Windows Context
key? Or...?
If you would name the stops along the way that you mean by your directions
to go left and right and up and down, I might know what you're referring to.
But with those purely directional directions, I can't figure out which menu
line and menus you may be describing.
Thank you very much.
----- Original Message -----
From: Flor Lynch <mailto:florlync@xxxxxx>
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 4:06 PM
Subject: Re: changing language situation
1. Bring up the JAWS context menu.
2. Down-arrow twice, and right-arrow once.
3. Down-arrow once, and right-arrow once.
You are now in the Synthesizer Language Submenu, from where you choose your
language.
----- Original Message -----
From: Robert Smith <mailto:rrrsmith@xxxxxxx>
To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, December 09, 2006 8:57 PM
Subject: changing language situation
Dear list,
Sorry the following turned out so long, but do need help!
Being interested in learning German, I found a couple of web sites that look
promising. I thought, though, that before down loading anything I should
check to see if Jaws would be able to read that language properly when it
appears on the screen. I went to Jaws 6 which is on my desktop, entered,
which brought up the context menu. I entered on open; found language, and
entered, found two items: Jaws language, which as I remember
contained American English, English, and Spanish. (sorry this is getting
so long)! closed that, and on the previous list found, language
synthesizer. Entered on that, and lo and behold found a long list of
foreign languages including German. Entered on that dis covered it did a
really good job of reading everything in my computer with a almost
un-understandable German accent; but did a beautiful job with some real
German I typed in.
Now the problem. I couldn't turn off the German talk!!! I tried everything
I know-which isn't very much; including reboot, complete turn off. German
was still there when computer turned back on. Finally after a couple of
hours, and an over-night rest and turning on computer again, and
some more piking around, German disappeared and English Jaws returned. My
question finally is, what should I do to close down the use of German and
returning to English?
Bob Smith
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