Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
- From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 24 May 2011 12:56:47 -0700
Anthony! I'm shocked! You mean you skipped the most stable version of JAWS
ever produced? Sorry to hear that, man! Are you up to JAWS 12 yet? Not that
I'm encouraging you to try, but just wondering...
Dave
Composed on a Dell Latitude 630 in the general vicinity of my Audio
Recording and Mixing Studios, San Francisco Bay Area.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Hodgetts" <hodgeab@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:51
Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
HiI had skipped jaws 7.0 completely and it cost me $500 at that time to
upgrade from 6 to 8. I am in Canada so it is also dependant on the US
dollar's value.
Anthony
--------------------------------------------------
From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 1:38 PM
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
> JP,
>
> Yes, some do have agencies who purchase for them, but they and the
> agencies
> still need to justify the cost to someone, so pricing is *always* a
> factor.
>
> Kimsan, It may take an arm, a leg, and your Mother-in-law to get back on
> board the JAWS train. Give them a call and see what it will cost to
> purchase
> the next version. I see from others that I for one am glad that I live in
> the U.S. and that I have kept my SMA up-to-date.
>
> Dave
> Composed on a Dell Latitude 630 in the general vicinity of my Audio
> Recording and Mixing Studios, San Francisco Bay Area.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Juan Pablo" <jpculasso@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:24
> Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>
>
> I do not why do you claim about the upgrades of jaws, pay or not pay?
> Almost of you receibe the software completely free, from diferents
> agencies
> or blind federations. Only a few people really pay the full price of the
> screen reader.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "kimsan" <kimsansong@xxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 4:16 PM
> Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>
>
>> How much is it to purchase jfw anyways? I ran out of SMA's.
>> I'm gunna try and stay up to date.
>> I hope its not an arm and a leg because if it is. I am S.O.L cuzz the pay
>> here at the school district sucks lol.
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Drew Hunthausen
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 12:05 PM
>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: RE: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual
>> ribbon"
>>
>> I think there are valid points on both sides of the argument. All I have
>> to
>> say is that Freedom Scientific has made some bad Jaws upgrades that cost
>> us
>> money, but with the relatively small blind population, they need to put
>> paid
>> upgrades out so that they can have the funding to keep improving the
>> product. Otherwise there wouldn't be money to make the good upgrades that
>> we
>> all like. Just my two sense worth
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Karen Hughes
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:53 AM
>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual
>> ribbon"
>>
>> tim, my point exactly. the upgrades are just a money grab and we the
>> blind
>> are victims of this highway robbery. karen
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Tim" <tim@xxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 11:39 AM
>> Subject: Re: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual
>> ribbon"
>>
>>
>>> But are the upgrades for JAWS really significant upgrades? From what I
>>> have heard there was virtually nothing worth upgrading to version 12
>>> for.
>>> A new version is put out every year which seems a bit much in my
>>> opinion.
>>> I think Freedom Scientific is doing this to its customers simply because
>>> it can. Put quite simply: if you can take someone's money why stop at
>>> only
>>
>>> taking some of their money. Freedom Scientific wants to see lots of
>>> dollars falling from the money tree which they seem to think I have
>>> growing in my backyard. This chosen method of doing sales along with the
>>> reauthorization code nightmare foisted upon its customers have caused me
>>> to switch to Window Eyes. Now I am truly free and quite happy about it.
>>>
>>> Tim
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Marquette, Ed" <Ed.Marquette@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 9:37 AM
>>> Subject: Paying for skipped versions of jaws; was "the virtual ribbon"
>>>
>>>
>>> Before we indict JAWS for predation against the blind, we probably
>>> should
>>> step back a little. Freedom Scientific's practice of requiring all
>>> interim versions to be brought up to date is not uncommon at all in
>>> vertical markets. Oracle does essentially the same thing. So long as
>>> the
>>
>>> customer has a "maintenance agreement" in effect, the customer gets
>>> upgrades for free -- plus technical support.
>>> Once the maintenance agreement lapses, to get the current version, there
>>> is a "catch-up" payment required. In fact, that's pretty much standard
>>> in
>>
>>> vertical market software.
>>> I'm using the term "vertical market software" to mean something other
>>> than
>>
>>> off-the-shelf shrink-wrap-licensed software like Microsoft Office.
>>> Even Microsoft Office has a vertical market type model for enterprise
>>> customers.
>>> So, I think the real argument is not whether Freedom Scientific is
>>> preying
>>
>>> on the blind, as one might be led to believe, but rather whether the
>>> vertical market model or the off-the-shelf model for software licensing
>>> is
>>
>>> more appropriate.
>>> I'm not trying to defend anyone; just trying to be fair to all.
>>>
>>> As long as you
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>> Behalf
>>
>>> Of Karen Hughes
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 8:52 AM
>>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>
>>> cy I agree with you and believe the blind are being penalized big time.
>>> I
>>> ask myself, would a seeing person put up with this. why could you not
>>> just
>>> purchase the current version. why do you have to pay for older versions
>>> you
>>> did not even want or need. Karen
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Cy Selfridge" <cyselfridge@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 8:28 AM
>>> Subject: RE: the virtual ribbon
>>>
>>>
>>>> It is funny that FS handles Open Book updates differently.
>>>> Regardless of how many versions you are behind the cost is, I believe,
>>>> only
>>>> $150 to get current.
>>>> Several years ago I had to bring my JAWS up to date and I think it was
>>>> something like $500.
>>>> What a bunch of nonsense.
>>>> Cy
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>> Of Karen Hughes
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 6:15 AM
>>>> To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>>
>>>> i too did not update so thought i would not have to pay for something i
>>>> did
>>>> not use. found out different when charged four hundred and fifty
>>>> dollars.
>>>> i
>>>> had to pay for the new update plus the ones i did not use. buyer
>>>> beware.
>>>> who
>>>>
>>>> said life was fair. karen
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Dawn Thullen" <gdandet@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 11:18 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I strongly urge you to buy the SMA if at all possible. I skipped a
>>>>>version
>>>>
>>>>>and the cost was ridiculous. Don't forget, the more versions you skip,
>>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>>more money it costs. As freedomscientific told me "just because you
>>>>>didn't
>>>>
>>>>>upgrade, didn't mean that technology didn't move on."
>>>>>
>>>>> Dawn
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Farfar Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 5:38 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: the virtual ribbon
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Alan,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You'll likely wait until you're in a pine box if you hope to get the
>>>>>> bugs
>>>>>> out. Cynically speaking (as I'm always reluctant to do) each new
>>>>>> version
>>>>>> will have new bugs and some old bugs remaining, ad infinitum .
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And in case you're not aware, failure to renew an SMA before a major
>>>>>> version
>>>>>> comes out will cost you a whole heck of a lot more money. I'll let
>>>>>> other
>>>>>> chime in on their experience. My advice is to purchase the SMA for 12
>>>>>> and
>>>>
>>>>>> 13
>>>>>> and wait for 13. I skipped version 10, for example, as it made me
>>>>>> ill.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>> Composed on a Dell Latitude 630 in the general vicinity of my Audio
>>>>>> Recording and Mixing Studios, San Francisco Bay Area.
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Alan Dicey" <adicey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 14:20
>>>>>> Subject: the virtual ribbon
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dear Kenny,
>>>>>> Thanks very much for that kind offer, but I only have JAWS 11.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I suppose I need to look at getting JAWS 12, but since I do not have
>>>>>> any
>>>>>> more SMA's, and I am hoping they will get all the bugs out of that
>>>>>> version
>>>>>> before I purchase it, well I will wait a bit more!
>>>>>> Besides, I understand that the "virtual ribbon" is not a total
>>>>>> "fix",
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> only helps out a bit, is that correct?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wow, I have been using the JAWS Menu bars since 1999, with JAWS 3.3!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And although I feel I am making a little progress getting the hang of
>>>>>> it,
>>>>
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> see it will be a slow learning curb!
>>>>>> A completely different thing!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks again!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With Best Regards,
>>>>>> Alan
>>>>>> Miami, Florida
>>>>>> Alan Dicey, President
>>>>>> United States Braille Chess Association - USBCA
>>>>>> "Yes, Blind and Visually Impaired People, Can, and Do, Play Chess!"
>>>>>> United States Braille Chess Association Home Page:
>>>>>> http://AmericanBlindChess.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Kenny Peyatt" <p.wildcat1234@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>> Sent: Monday, May 23, 2011 3:51 PM
>>>>>> Subject: the virtual ribbon
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi allan The virtual ribbon is a jaws 12 feature. To turn it on in
>>>>>>> jaws
>>>>>>> 12
>>>>>>> You go to the setttings center. If you like I can connect to your
>>>>>>> computer
>>>>>>> through jaws tandom and activate the feature for you.
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>>>> line.
>>>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the
>>>>>>> list,
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>>> line.
>>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>>> contact
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>>> line.
>>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>>> or
>>>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> JFW related links:
>>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>>> line.
>>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>>
>>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>>> or
>>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> JFW related links:
>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>> line.
>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>
>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>> or
>>>> the
>>>> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
>>>> the
>>>> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> JFW related links:
>>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>>> JFW List instructions:
>>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject
>>>> line.
>>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>>
>>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list,
>>>> or
>>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>> --
>>> JFW related links:
>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>> JFW List instructions:
>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>>> Alternative archives located at:
>>> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>>>
>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>>> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
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>>> --
>>> JFW related links:
>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>> JFW List instructions:
>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
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>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
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>>>
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>>> --
>>> JFW related links:
>>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>>> Scripting mailing list:
>>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>>> JFW List instructions:
>>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
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>>>
>>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
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>>
>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
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>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
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>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>> Alternative archives located at:
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>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
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>> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
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>> --
>> JFW related links:
>> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
>> Scripting mailing list:
>> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
>> JFW List instructions:
>> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
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>>
>> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
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>
> --
> JFW related links:
> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
> Scripting mailing list:
> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
> JFW List instructions:
> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> Alternative archives located at:
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>
> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
> the
> way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
> the
> list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> --
> JFW related links:
> JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
> Scripting mailing list:
> http://lists.the-jdh.com/listinfo.cgi/scriptography-the-jdh.com
> JFW List instructions:
> To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> Alternative archives located at:
> http://n2.nabble.com/JAWS-for-Windows-f2145279.html
>
> If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
> the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
> contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
--
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JFW homepage: http://www.freedomscientific.com/
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To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
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If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the
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