Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike

  • From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Mon, 28 Mar 2005 08:58:35 -0800

Well, that's what I mean, then.  they do this between every two major new 
releases.  I didn't know you didn't know that.  No problem.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gene" <guystevens@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 8:45 AM
Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike


5.1 was free.

Gene


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 11:38 AM
Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike


> there's a 6.1 coming out almost immediately, and that's a free update.  I
> forget the history exactly, so I don't know if 5.1 was a paid upgrade or a
> free update.  Sorry.  I just went straight from 4.51 to version 6.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Gene" <guystevens@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 8:18 AM
> Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>
>
> If I remember correctly wasn't that the idea behind 5.1?
>
> Gene
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 11:16 AM
> Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>
>
>> Not to clog this all up too badly, but I agree with both you guys, and
>> just
>> want to add that I've heard and read enough about the enormous pressure
>> put
>> on software developers to have something ready for release that it's
>> impossible to ship anything that's bug free.  This is perhaps avoidable,
>> perhaps not, even with good intentions.  But it's not deliberate and
>> sinister.
>>
>> Second, I'm a little confused.  There is a complaint that bugs ought to
>> be
>> fixed for free with free updates and patches.  But this is exactly what
>> FS
>> does!  I don't get what you're saying.  Each time there's a free update,
>> it
>> not only contains a new feature or two, but a long lists of repaired
>> bugs.
>> Am I missing something?  It sounded as if the person doesn't know that
>> there
>> are already free patches and updates, usually a number of them between
>> full
>> new upgrade releases.
>>
>> Just checking.
>> Thanks for everything,
>> Daniel
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Gene" <guystevens@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 8:07 AM
>> Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>
>>
>> You are right. I wasn't defending FS... just trying to clear up a point
>> about how software is intentionally released with bugs.
>>
>> Gene
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Alex Midence" <alex.midence@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 11:04 AM
>> Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>
>>
>>> Ok, first things first, Hi to all.  Haven't been on this list in quite
>>> some time.  Anyway, on to the matter of Jaws 6.  Alluding to your
>>> message about how complex it is to write a program, noone is saying it
>>> isn't difficult.  In fact, noone's even saying that they expect every
>>> new version of Jaws to be perfect.  Now then, what *is* being said is
>>> that they should just release *free* (yes, folks I said it!) FREE
>>> patches and/or bug fixes.  New versions should be for innovations and
>>> new features.  Here's an example:
>>>
>>> Jaws six has a diabolical problem with virtual find.  The damn thing
>>> simply does not work propperly.  It only seems to work if you're in
>>> the same block quote but won't go and find something in another frame,
>>> in a table two headings below you, or, sometimes, in the next cell
>>> over in the table you're actually in.  A FREE patch or bug fix should
>>> be made available to fix this problem on your existing version.  An
>>> example of an innovation would be, for instance, this remote access
>>> that is now available to us.  I can remember all the amount of
>>> postings a year or so back about how this was the new wave of the
>>> future and so on.  It's great that it's now available.  That is an
>>> innovation.  If you want it, you pay to buy it in the next version.
>>> If your jaws cursor begins to speak in another language and you need
>>> it fixed, if jaws starts talking dirty to you when you pull down the
>>> file menu, if it begins to laugh hysterically when you are trying to
>>> read how bad you did at the stock market on a website, that, friends
>>> is a bug and requires a FREE fix.  That allusion to cars which someone
>>> made in another post was a very good illustration.  A bug that hampers
>>> your job performance and makes you use a prior version where it works
>>> correctly (never did understand how that could be, by the way), can
>>> potentially screw your life up just as badly as a design flaw in a
>>> car's causing an accident on the road can.  Both can put you out of
>>> commission.
>>>
>>> Right then, that's my two cents,
>>>
>>> Everyone have a good one,
>>>
>>> Alex
>>>
>>>
>>> On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 10:34:44 -0500, Gene <guystevens@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> wrote:
>>>> I think before people complain about software with bugs they should try
>>>> writing a computer program. I have... and still do. It is unbelievably
>>>> complex when dealing with something as involved as Jaws. There is just
>>>> no
>>>> way to plan for every contingency in advance.
>>>>
>>>> Gene
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 10:28 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> >A couple of corrections.  Sorry about typing too fast on too little
>>>> coffee:
>>>> >
>>>> > 1.  it's "reprehensible," not "reprehensive."
>>>> > 2.  This sentence needed the word "fixed," which I neglected to type
>>>> > even
>>>> > though I was thinking it:
>>>> > Would that you could get a manufacturing flaw in the brakes or fuel
>>>> system
>>>> > of your Camry fixed as easily as you can download an update for the
>>>> > current
>>>> > release of Jaws.
>>>> >
>>>> > Thanks for your forebearance, all.
>>>> > Daniel
>>>> >
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> > From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 6:56 AM
>>>> > Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Hello.  This isn't what I said.  Please look below.  You are
>>>> > expressing
>>>> > a
>>>> > conspiracy theory, which is not the way I would account for the
>>>> > release
>>>> of
>>>> > imperfect software.  I'm not saying I love Microsoft uncritically, or
>>>> love
>>>> > Freedom Scientific uncritically, but this isn't the actual logic
>>>> involved.
>>>> >
>>>> > One of many points to be aware of:  When a version of Jaws is
>>>> > released
>>>> > with
>>>> > bugs, it's free updates that attempt to correct them.  It is *not*
>>>> > that
>>>> > you
>>>> > have to spring for the next paid version (upgrade) in order to fix a
>>>> > malfunction.  Not in most cases.
>>>> >
>>>> > Here is an example that is at least partially analogous.   In the
>>>> > 1950s,
>>>> > when the Big Three American automakers became notorious among
>>>> > socially
>>>> and
>>>> > economically critical thinkers and writers for pushing Americans to
>>>> > continually trade in their cars for new models, this tactic for
>>>> > corporate
>>>> > enrichment was not accomplished by sending out Fords, Pontiacs and
>>>> > Plymouths
>>>> > riddled with manufacturing defects that would, at the least,
>>>> > inconvenience
>>>>
>>>> > a
>>>> > driver or, at worst, potentially cause a crash.  By which I mean a
>>>> > *real*
>>>> > crash.  With broken steel  and glass, blood, twisted bodies.  No.
>>>> >
>>>> > It was done by racing each other to put new models on the nation's
>>>> > showroom
>>>> > floors each September that most often distinguished themselves from
>>>> > previous
>>>> > models in the same product line by cosmetic changes like differently
>>>> > shaped
>>>> > fenders, new colors, and so forth, with relatively minor mechanical
>>>> > changes
>>>> > to critical components like engines, transmissions, suspensions, and
>>>> > brakes.
>>>> > It was a reprehensive and greedy practice, and it made a company like
>>>> > General Motors economically powerful beyond anything that had been
>>>> dreamed
>>>> > of to that time, or at least since the days of powerful steel,
>>>> > petroleum
>>>> > and
>>>> > railroad barons,  to the point where there was a saying in government
>>>> > circles that went , "What's good for GM is good for America."  But
>>>> > that
>>>> > all
>>>> > was not achieved by producing and shipping severely flawed product
>>>> > and
>>>> > then
>>>> > smilingly telling the customer to trade in his or her new car to
>>>> > upgrade,
>>>>
>>>> > or
>>>> > face being stranded on the highway or killed in a collision.
>>>> > The update process that helps to fix and patch a flawed software
>>>> > release
>>>> > is
>>>> > free, for one thing, and is comparable not to the sales of new
>>>> > products
>>>> > but
>>>> > rather a safety recall.  Would that you could get a manufacturing
>>>> > flaw
>>>> > in
>>>> > the brakes or fuel system of your Camry as easily as you can download
>>>> > an
>>>> > update for the current release of Jaws.
>>>> >
>>>> > So, when I see Alan Greenspan quoted in the New York times saying
>>>> > "What's
>>>> > good for Freedom Scientific is good for America," then I'll
>>>> > reconsider
>>>> > this
>>>> > explanation.  Until then, as we say, hope this helps.
>>>> >
>>>> > thanks for everything,
>>>> > Daniel
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > ,busineweroful xtrabut itbodei
>>>> > s showroom a new model an in
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> > From: "John Miller" <n1umj@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Monday, March 28, 2005 5:38 AM
>>>> > Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > it's usually done on purpose so you'll buy the next update. though I
>>>> don't
>>>> > find a lot of issues most people do with jaws.
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> > From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 9:34 PM
>>>> > Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Not meaning to be sarcastic, it's worth noting that almost *no*
>>>> > software
>>>> > is
>>>> > ever released in a form anywhere near perfection.  That's just taken
>>>> > for
>>>> > granted, I think, and then come the updates to patch and debug the
>>>> > flaws
>>>> > of
>>>> > the official release.  Just the way things are done,I think.
>>>> >
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> > From: "David Grossoehme" <davegross1@xxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 6:23 PM
>>>> > Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Hi Guys:  I believe that this subject was spoken about right after
>>>> > JFW6.0
>>>> > hit the market.  It seems like another program that wasn't completely
>>>> > tested
>>>> > before it hit the market.  Unfortunately, it just one more thing to
>>>> > set
>>>> us
>>>> > back from the sighted user of a computer.
>>>> > Your Friend
>>>> > Dave
>>>> >
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> > From: <philwh@xxxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 3:12 PM
>>>> > Subject: Re: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >> Hi.
>>>> >> I am not the orginal person that started this thread,
>>>> >> but this is my experience and what the techs told me.
>>>> >> any change in your computer requires a new key.
>>>> >> I added an additional hard drive. i had
>>>> >> to reauthorize.
>>>> >> I replaced a bad floppy drive, another key gone.
>>>> >> I temporarily put a different sound card in
>>>> >> to test it, another key.
>>>> >> by the way, jfw doesn't tell you what has prompted the
>>>> >> reauthorization,
>>>> >> it just says that you must run the proceedure or
>>>> >> run in demo mode.
>>>> >> this problem has happened to me even if I haven't changed anything
>>>> >> that I know of.
>>>> >> I have had to call fs 3 times so far to
>>>> >> have them fix my keys.
>>>> >> the last time, the tech told me to buy a dongle
>>>> >> to solve the problem, more money for fs of course.
>>>> >> phil
>>>> >>
>>>> >> On Sun, Mar 27, 2005 at 04:03:07PM -0500, Jerry Neufeld wrote:
>>>> >>> Hello Dick.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I was curious about FS's verification procedure. Do you happen to
>>>> >>> know
>>>> >>> what
>>>> >>> they consider a significcant change in the machine? And if they do
>>>> >>> come
>>>> >>> up
>>>> >>> with what they view a significant change, I assume they allow
>>>> >>> eloquence
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> tell you so? If I ask these questions, it is because one of my
>>>> >>> machines
>>>> >>> will
>>>> >>> no longer talk once the desktop comes up, or at least, I think it's
>>>> >>> up.
>>>>
>>>> >>> I
>>>> >>> will know tomorrow when an assistant confirms my hypothesis that it
>>>> >>> is
>>>> >>> the
>>>> >>> new SoundBlaster audigy platinum that wants registering before it
>>>> >>> lets
>>>> >>> me
>>>> >>> proceed.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> In any event, any info you have on this issue would be interesting
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> a
>>>> >>> lot
>>>> >>> of us.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Thanks.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Jerry
>>>> >>> jerry.neufeld@xxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> >>> From: "AB7HW Dick Lee Chrisman" <ab7hw@xxxxxxx>
>>>> >>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> >>> Sent: Sunday, March 27, 2005 3:50 PM
>>>> >>> Subject: New features JFW 6.0 that I dislike
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> > One new feature that started with JFW 6.0 is the many times JFW
>>>> >>> > wants
>>>> >>> > to
>>>> >>> > perform a Verification!  It seems like JFW 6.0 seems to think I
>>>> >>> > have
>>>> >>> > made
>>>> >>> > a
>>>> >>> > change to MY COMPUTER and I under line MY COMPUTER, I have had to
>>>> have
>>>> >>> > my
>>>> >>> > Authorization Keys up dated 10 times or more so far!
>>>> >>> > So I have to go out and have a email sent to Freedom Scientific
>>>> >>> > to
>>>> >>> > request
>>>> >>> > new Keys, in 24 hours or so they do up date my number of Keys,
>>>> >>> > but
>>>> >>> > if
>>>>
>>>> >>> > I
>>>> >>> > do
>>>> >>> > not do this in time I will be running in Demo Mode while being a
>>>> Legal
>>>> >>> > paid
>>>> >>> > up JFW user with additional SMA's paid for!
>>>> >>> > Freedom Scientific does not argue about providing new Keys, to
>>>> >>> > their
>>>> >>> > credit!
>>>> >>> > I wrote Freedom Scientific and ask about, but of course they have
>>>> >>> > never
>>>> >>> > heard of this complaint or problem?
>>>> >>> > Today I rebooted or should I say shut off the computer and
>>>> >>> > restarted
>>>> >>> > and
>>>> >>> > both times it ask for a new Verification and of course removed
>>>> >>> > one
>>>> Key
>>>> >>> > for
>>>> >>> > each occurrence, Poop!
>>>> >>> > I hope Freedom Scientific finds this to be as big of a Pain to
>>>> >>> > them
>>>> as
>>>> >>> > it
>>>> >>> > is
>>>> >>> > for me and fixes this problem!
>>>> >>> > I don't think their new way of Verifying users is well thought
>>>> >>> > out,
>>>> so
>>>> >>> > that
>>>> >>> > is my only complaint on the new JFW 6.0!
>>>> >>> > I look forward to their correcting this dilemma!
>>>> >>> > Dick Chrisman
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > --
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>>>> >
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