To the author of this message. Sorry for the public reply but I can't make lotus show me the message headers. I'm not on the mozilla accessibility list but you may forward my post reguarding keyboard access and mozilla. "david poehlman" <david.poehlman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent by: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 09/20/2004 11:44 AM Please respond to jfw To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> cc: Subject: Re: Fw: Comments on Mozilla content keyboard navigation proposal would you mind posting to the mozilla accessibility list? Johnnie Apple Seed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sean M McMahon" <smcmahon@xxxxxxxx> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Cc: "jfw users email list" <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 2:29 PM Subject: Re: Fw: Comments on Mozilla content keyboard navigation proposal Open source is another reason why I love good-old lynx the cat. Yes it lacks some modern support but it does have a few great functions. One: numbering of form fields and links where a person can just go to the numbered item. Two: you can expand all items in a combobox so a person can see all items without selecting one option. That's a critical feature when you encounter comboboxes which automatically select an item and go to a different webpage with out your consent, see the creative labs site www.creative.com and click on download drivers to see this in action. Finally, Lynx has a settable option you can explicately hit enter to go into a mode where you can input data into a form. I think we're all a little fed-up with IE domination. I applaud your efforts. "david poehlman" <david.poehlman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent by: jfw-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 09/20/2004 06:02 AM Please respond to jfw To: "jfw users email list" <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> cc: Subject: Fw: Comments on Mozilla content keyboard navigation proposal Johnnie Apple Seed ----- Original Message ----- From: "Peter Korn" <Peter.Korn@xxxxxxx> To: <mozilla-accessibility@xxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 2:18 AM Subject: Re: Comments on Mozilla content keyboard navigation proposal Greetings all, In the past 4 days we've had a very creative, thoughtful, and spirited discussion about Mozilla content interaction from the keyboard, inspired by the Mozilla content keyboard navigation proposal from Sun. This is wonderful, and one of the things I believe many of us working on open source accessibility have hoped for - that the process of developing accessibility can be much more two way, and more on a peer-to-peer/participatory basis than it tends to be in the proprietary desktops. Looking over all of the messages on this thread, I'd like to try to tease out the key themes, in no particular order: 1. Preserving basic character navigation across the web page is good (e.g. arrows, Ctrl-arrows, Home/End/PgUp/PgDn) - they should behave as they do in word processors and the like. 2. Structural navigation is good. Moving from header to header, sub-header to sub-header, etc. 3. Forms are tricky, and we need some clear way for a user to get into and out of forms. No real concensus seems to have emerged yet on what this should be. 4. Table navigation is very important. Moving up/down columns in a table is important. Having the screen reader "do the right thing" in those instances (read the entire row probably) is important. 5. Configurability, at least of the non-basic character movement keys, is important. 6. This isn't just about Mozilla on UNIX/Linux; Mozilla on Windows is as affected by what we're doing. 7. We need to keep in mind what folks are coming from (e.g. JAWS + IE). 8. This discussion is generating some interesting and perhaps novel ideas ("zooming"), though no concensus is emerging on them, let alone widespread understanding of them. Have I missed any of the major themes in my summary above? In addition to comments falling into these big themes, there has also been a lot of excellent specific feedback on the proposal (keyboard command suggestions, etc.), most notably from our friends at IBM. I'd like to remind everyone that I've requested a comment deadline of 24 September. While I have no fear that we won't get sufficient feedback by that time (judging by how much we've seen in just 4 days), it would be very helpful if in the next days we could: a. Find any major themes I may have missed, to ensure we don't miss 'em. b. Push more for concensus, where possible. Where it isn't possible, then those who do the implementation work - the keyboard accessibility maintainers of mozilla in "open source parlance" - will simply have to make implementation decisions based on their best understandings of what to do informed by all of this excellent feedback. Of course theme #5 above ("configurability is important") may go a long way toward addressing implementation(s) that a given user might disagree with... Thank you again for all of your excellent feedback. Keep it coming! Regards, Peter Korn Sun Accessibility team _______________________________________________ mozilla-accessibility mailing list mozilla-accessibility@xxxxxxxxxxx http://mail.mozilla.org/listinfo/mozilla-accessibility -- To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line. 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