[jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP

If it's no extra trouble.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Martyn" <johnrobertmartyn@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 10:17 PM
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP


Did you want the function that retrieves the window handles as well besides
the functions and scripts?
John

-----Original Message-----
From: jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Bob Kennedy
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 4:03 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP

I'd like a copy.  If you want to send it off list that would be fine.
intheshop@xxxxxxx is my address.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Martyn" <johnrobertmartyn@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 1:29 PM
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP


My mistake before, they do have window handles. I was thinking like the
track list with objects within a track list like that, but for dialogs,
apparently I did find a way to grab all the window handles that were a child
of the GetRealWindow. It was tricky to get it to focus to the right items,
but it works like a charm now. Many barriers had to be overcome. If you'd
like an example of the code, I can post it, but it stretches out into
different functions as well as I had to create the tab and shift tab keys
that detected for XP and lower and if dialog active with multi select turned
on, then it works. I didn't want to interfere with other dialog windows that
did work fine.
John Martyn
-----Original Message-----
From: jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Geoff Chapman
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 5:26 AM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP


So just in order to steer conversation back to topic, and to John's original
queery of navigating tabbable to elements in the preferences dialog in
iTunes 10.6. So are you saying John, that this only happens on win xp
systems then? and not on win7?  and only begun in 10.6?
is this correct?

Surely they couldn't get away with breaking things on that kind of scale,
could they?
... oh don't answer that! I already know what it is!
<sigh.>
And, do please keep us up-to-date then,on any solutions/workarounds you may
be trialing for this one?

I haven't got itunes 10 6 on this old win xp laptop, and I was about to
install it on my old desktop 2003 xp system on it, but it decided to die
just last week! so guess it's time I launched into win7.

hmmm.

So are you also saying, that these tabbable to controls, don't form actual
standard separate navigable windows? as my extremely limited understanding
was they do in normal app dialogs?


----- Original Message -----
From: "Geoff Chapman" <gch@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 11:17 PM
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP


> hmmmm, well, my understanding would've been,
> that their motivation to make this a good user-experience under windows,
> could, possibly, have stemmed from the fact, that my understanding was
> that
> macs only still make up a teency percentage of the amount of people
> actually
> using itunes! either to buy stuff from their store, or to transfer stuff
> to
> their IOS devices! and that many of them are blind/vision impaired!  So
> I'd
> have thought that would have provided, and I think must've to some degree,
> sufficient economic motivation to care about it for vips.  They own/buy
> ipods/iPhones and music too. and a great many more would under windows
> than
> on macs with voiceover.
> would it not be so?
> I realize you can use the store directly on those devices, and thanks
> Trouble for pointing out that's primarily how you get around the dodgy
> performance of iTunes store under windows.
> But, if it wasn't dodgy, and worked well, you'd enjoy utilizing it there
> too
> would not you?
>
> I know that traditionally, windoweyes has been much more in their
> developer
> ears though than FS have been, though  last time I tried the iTunes store
> on
> Windoweyes, which admittedly was some time back now, it too had issues
> with
> whole pages rendering to us via speech, what was no longer actually
> onscreen, thus the whole virtual buffer refresh deal again.
>
> Somehow they've implemented things differently than the browsers do, where
> you can reliably, well mostly reliably, arrow to buttons and links in
> virtual pc mode, hit enter on them, and it tightly integrates with
> activating that button/link in the real world. This is not so much the
> case
> with jaws under iTunes. and I find I may often have to either:
> (a.) turn off the virtual cursor all together with insert+Z, and try and
> locate the particular link/edit box  with the realWorld tab key, with
> virtual cursor turned off, (coz even leaving it on and doing that rather
> than arrowing to them doesn't seem to always do it. and/or
> (b.) do a bit of the, not oft utilized, Control+Insert+Delete function,
> which attempts to route the RealWorld application focus to the position of
> the Virtual cursor. That sometimes works also.
>
> And a bit of judicious Jaws+Escape manual screen OSM refreshing along the
> way.
>
> oh, and usage of place temporary marker before clicking a button to
> preview
> songs, goes a long way in helping relocate one's place too.
> grrr!
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Trouble" <trouble1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2012 3:21 AM
> Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Troubles with iTunes in Win XP
>
>
>> It does work with voice over. However, the
>> windows version they are not to worried with,
>> because they have few programs for windows. So
>> they just make it work with windows. It is up to
>> the makers of windows screen readers to handle that job.
>>
>> At 07:32 AM 3/13/2012, you wrote:
>>>Yeh, but how does it run on a Mac with VoiceOver? I'm sure they test it
>>>on their own hardware with their own OS and their own screen reader.
>>>I've never been sure what Apple's motivation was to spend resources
>>>making iTunes accessible on Windows when they could just respond by
>>>telling everyone it works with VoiceOver.
>>>
>>>On 13/03/12 06:19, Geoff Chapman wrote:
>>> > Far out! Apple seriously drive me insane with what they're always
>>> > dooen
>>> > to
>>> > break itunes accessibility with nearly every version they bring out!
>>> > don't
>>> > you reckon John?
>>> >
>>> > it's got a serious refreshing conflict/focus syncronization
>>> > difficulties
>>> > already, with jaws I reckon, in the itunes store, which makes using it
>>> > a
>>> > total pain in bottom difficulty, which either FS or apple reeeally
>>> > should
>>> > attend to in my view, fix, and now they've broken preferences dialog?
>>> > my
>>> > goodness.
>>> > nobody obviously tests each release for this stuff before they release
>>> > it
>>> > eh. why on earth not! I cry. in the
>>> wilderness no doubt. has anyone ansered
>>> > you on this email adress you've got here below before John?  Do they
>>> > even
>>> > monitor it realistically?
>>> > I'll jolly email them as well if so!
>>> > I've kept itunes 10.3 and jaws 11 on this laptop here for exactly
>>> > these
>>> > reasons! 10.4 they messed around with the tab
>>> order of where the search box
>>> > occurred, and then tried to do automatic jumps of focus after search
>>> > has
>>> > completed into the iTunes store, thus meanig that if you hit f6 then,
>>> > when
>>> > it'd done that, in the midst of it trying to get itself together re
>>> > the
>>> > refreshing conflict, you'd crash the thing sooo jolly easily!
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > grrr!
>>> > sorry for the rant peeps.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>> > From: "John Martyn" <johnrobertmartyn@xxxxxxxxx>
>>> > To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> > Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2012 11:26 AM
>>> > Subject: [jawsscripts] Troubles with iTunes in Win XP
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >> This is going to sound a little strange, but now in the preferences
>>> >> window,
>>> >> when you tab, it skips all the objects contained within that window.
>>> >> It
>>> >> only
>>> >> happens under the first two tabs, but the rest of them work fine.
>>> >> This
>>> >> problem started with iTunes 10.6 and happens with or without the
>>> >> blind
>>> >> tunes
>>> >> scripts.
>>> >> My question is, can I walk through focusing objects if I know the
>>> >> window
>>> >> handle of the preference window? I was thinking for XP systems, I
>>> >> could
>>> >> create a tab and shift tab key script that will walk through the
>>> >> objects,
>>> >> but I don't see any function that could do this. I am really at a
>>> >> loss
>>> >> as
>>> >> to
>>> >> what I can do for XP systems other than email accessibility@xxxxxxxxx
>>> >> and
>>> >> pray they hear my message.
>>> >>
>>> >> The tab key as it is in XP just jumps to SDM controls though you can
>>> >> change
>>> >> the tabs just fine. I am guessing apple removed the tab index
>>> >> somehow.
>>> >>
>>> >> What should I do? If I can fix it for XP systems, I'd like to because
>>> >> apple
>>> >> most likely isn't going to do something for the old XP operating
>>> >> system.
>>> >>
>>> >> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>> >>
>>> >> I am using the focusChangedEventX to work with the object elements.
>>> >> If
>>> >> I
>>> >> use
>>> >> the objectStateChanged Event iTunes goes nuts and doesn't respond.
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks in advance,
>>> >>
>>> >> John Martyn
>>>
>>>--
>>>Christopher (CJ)
>>>chaltain@xxxxxxxxx
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