[openbeos] Re: Openness
- From: "Jorge G. Mare (a.k.a. Koki)" <koki@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: openbeos@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 03:27:31 -0700
Hi Charlie,
Charlie Clark wrote:
Am 12.05.2007 um 21:35 schrieb Jorge G. Mare (a.k.a. Koki):
I may be blunt, I admit that: but my intentions are sincere and for
the best interest of Haiku. I doubt that any of the people that I
have addressed my messages to (with whom I have a good relationship)
feel that I have been disrespectful to them. But if they do, they
know they can tell me so in the face and will issue an apology on the
spot, right on this list. Plus, they are all adults, so I am sure
they can defend themselves.
It's not bluntness that's at issue. It's also not sincerity. It's
about brow-beating, overinflating expectations and some rather bizarre
ideas about the responsibilities of a charitable body and the usual
nebulosity about "community". A bit less of the missionary zeal would
be a help. There are less than twenty active developers working on
Haiku and not enough money in the pot for paying one of them for a month.
I gave my input to the issues of lack of openness that somebody else
(who is actually a well-known developer) raised by starting this thread,
and I did so because I believe that the status quo is extremely
detrimental for Haiku. Furthermore, I know that some of the devs agree
with that assessment. So this is not just Koki brow-beating and
overinflating expectations as you would like others to believe.
Now, since you mention the lack of money and developers, what is Haiku
doing about it? What is it doing about raising more funds? What is it
doing about getting more developers? This is what this is all about.
All this complaining about lack of resources and underfunding is sounds
like a broken record, and it's nothing but whining and excuses not to
take the bull by the horns. It is very easy to give explanations of why
things do not or cannot get done; anybody can do that. But not many
people are willing to confront the issues and try to do something about
them.
You are free to choose the take the easy way out and resign yourself to
the status quo, but don't complain because others try to do the right
thing of actually addressing the problems instead of just giving up. The
things that I have said may not sound very nice, but that does not make
them illegitimate.
As for the developers defending themselves: they're mainly far too
polite for that and prefer coding to argument. Ingo's closing remark
was pretty clear if you chose to listen to it but instead you dragged
up your old arguments which are essentially about giving *you* the
power to do and decide.
I don't care about power. You are making all this up. If all I wanted
was power, I would have remained as an admin. You don't have a clue of
what you are talking about.
With regards to the developers, I think I know them enough to know that
if something bothers them, they will tell me directly. Nobody asked you
to be their messenger.
Project management is important as is accountability but neither sit
easy with underfunded volunteer arrangements.
Here goes the whining again. I say, if the project is underfunded, try
to do something about it, not just resign yourself to the fact that it
is a hopeless situation. That's not going to improve the situation, nor
is it going to inspire the developers or the community.
As for delegation and openness: the Haiku developers have done this
all perfectly with respect to the website, the icon set and other issues.
I have the highest regard for the Haiku developers. But even they admit
not having the mindset or motivation to handle stuff unrelated to
development. This non-developmental stuff has been neglected for too
long, and it's simply not happening. So while you may want to live in
your "everything is perfect dreamworld," there are many in the community
and some developers too that are aware of the issues, and would like to
see something done about them.
BTW, and for your information, the new website was created under my
direction, not that of the devs. May I also remind you that while some
held discussions to death over a long period of time about how bad all
the CMS out there were and how this or that system was better than all
the others, somebody came along, stepped up to the plate and actually
delivered.
What I really don't get is that we're having this discussion on this
list although you were part of the admin team. No, I don't want to
know the details, but it strikes me as a failure to understand the
basics of collective responsibility to resign on an issue and then try
and force change from the outside instead of moving on.
Haiku is an open source community project; there is nothing stopping
anyone from trying to participate from the outside, even for a former
admin like me. Your notion that anybody that quits the admin group has
to move on is just ludicrous. What is this? La Cosa Nostra?
Besides, this is an open mailing list, and people are free to express
their opinions or give their suggestions (this is what I am doing). If
you are not interested in any particular subject, all you have to do is
stop reading.
I'm all for free speech, so feel free to think and write that I am
just filling the list with hot air under the guise of professionalism
in order to feed my ego. I am bit puzzled, though, as I have also
done some hard work for Haiku, and that has apparently not stopped
you from being critical of my actions. Double standard? Or code is
all that counts to gain respect? :P
What double standards? You want a pat on the back from me? Why? Can I
have one for all the work I've done? We've both done work for Haiku
and received recognition for it at the time. That's enough for me.
Beyond that for Haiku it really is the coding that counts.
I don't want anything from you. I am just asking that if you are going
to tell me that I should not criticize others because they have made
contributions, why do you not apply the same standard to yourself before
criticizing me?
To end, I just wish more people made their voice heard on this topic...
Cheers,
Koki
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