[gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set to 'Not Configured'

  • From: TAZAMAL HUSSAIN <tazamal_hussain@xxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 21:27:47 +0000

 
Okay cool, so I loaded a copy of the NTUSER.dat file from the domain default 
user profile. I'll test it on that first... and build some confidence, then 
load the ACTUAL domain one and make the change.... i know i;m being cautious...
 
Any comments on the fact that the NTUSER.pol file doesn't exist in any of my 
user profiles folders, i am slightly concerned about this now... Now, going 
through the massive trail this question has had:
 
"This will happen if when building the default profile, you copy across 
NTuser.dat but not NTUSER.POL"
seems like this has happened... now when i built my default profile i followed 
an article that suggested you log onto a machine with a user... configure 
everything the way you want it... logg off... log on as an admin and hit the 
'copy to' button when the required profile is selected (in propeties of My 
Computer, advanced, user profiles, settings... Thats all i did, would this have 
not copied EVERYTHING including the .pol file? 
 
thanks all for your patience... nice one.
 
Taz> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:03:31 -0800> From: darren@xxxxxxxxxx> To: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'> > Tazamal-> Now that you have the hive file loaded, 
you can make any changes to it as you would a normal registry value. Once you 
unload that hive again, the changes are then saved to the ntuser.dat file and 
subsequently created user accounts should pick up the value change.> > Darren> 
> -----Original message-----> From: TAZAMAL HUSSAIN 
tazamal_hussain@xxxxxxxxxxx> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 15:14:03 -0500> To: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not> Configured'> > > > > Alan/Guys,> > > > Okay... I managed to load 
the Domain Default User Hive and yes, the registr> y key is in it and set....> 
> > > So, is it possible somehow to edit this and then replace the NTUSER.dat 
fil> e sitting in the default user profile.> > > > I;m getting out of my depth 
here BUT would really like to learn the interna> l workings here. I also dont 
see the .pol file in ANY of my roaming profile> users profile folders.... is 
this bad?> > > > > > From: syspro@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: > Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'Date: Wed, 28 No> v 2007 13:41:22 +1100> > > > > > > > > 
> > > > > > > > > Hi Tazamal,> > > > > > To open the registry hive you must:-> 
> > > Start regedit> > Click on Hkey_Local_Machine> > Click on file/Load Hive> 
> Then navigate to the ntuser.dat file and select it> > Give it a new name (say 
aaaa) and you should be able to browse it> > When finished, click on the root 
of the attached hive (say aaaa) and click > file/Unload Hive. It gives a 
warning as to whether you are sure. Provided y> ou have clicked on the correct 
branch it will be OK. > > The fact that you do not see an NTUSER.pol file sort 
of explains your probl> em. It should have been copied over when the NTUser.dat 
file was copied ove> r> > > > To get round you current problems I would suggest 
a new policy with the set> ting set to DISABLED. This will fix your immediate 
problem, both for new an> d existing users. You can then go through and rebuild 
your default profile > at your leisure, test it and implement it. When this is 
done and you are co> nfident that all (most) of your registries sitting on 
machines have been fi> xed, remove the policy all together.> > > > Alan 
Cuthbertson> > > > > > > > > > > > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> ehalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAINSent: 
Wednesday, 28 November 2007 12:27 PMTo: gptal> k@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] 
Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after se> t to 'Not Configured'> > > > Guys 
After reading all the replies I think I need to take some time and mak> e sure 
this is done correctly. What Darren suggested was what I was going t> o do, now 
though i'm hestating as i;m not sure as there might be useful stu> ff in my 
default profile that i;m not aware of. As far as I remember I only> did desktop 
and start menu type clean ups, but it was a while back. I cant> find the 
document I produced :( Alan, some questions for you (please bear> with me if 
this basic stuff) from your points i'm unsure how to carry out:> 2) How do I 
open the registry hive?3) I dont see an NTUSER.pol file i only> see an 
NTUSER.dat fileI Copied the whole Default User profile folder from > the 
netlogon share to my laptop d:\ as suggested in step 1 Have I understoo> d what 
you meant correctly? In a locked down type environment do you guys h> ave a 
kind of good lockdown policy that you have previously documented and > have to 
hand when going into a new environment. A kind of standa> rd procedur> e the 
default profile should look like? In my case, users only need to fire> up 
Microsoft Office, Internet Explorer, use certain mapped drives, pick up> 
printers and run some LOB applications.. nothing else. I would be very int> 
erested to see how the experienced guys deal with these kinds of things... > 
might be asking for a lot. I understand this all down to choice and situati> on 
that depoyment is taking place in, but any useful would be handy to know> .... 
This is excellent learning for me... so thanks > > > > > > > > From: 
syspro@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: > Problem 
with GPO Setting even after set to 'Not Configured'Date: Wed, 28 No> v 2007 
08:17:01 +1100> > > > Tazamal,> > > > While Darren is correct in what he 
suggests, I am not sure it is something > you want to rush in to. You may find 
there are a lot of useful things in yo> ur default profile that you are not 
really aware of. It really depends on h> ow well documented your process is for 
building the default profile.> > > > As a short term check I would do the 
following:-> > > > > > Copy the default profile to somewhere where you can play 
with it> > Open the registry hive and see whether the offending key is present> 
> Open the NTUSER.pol file with notepad and see if the key is present there. > 
(The file is a bit messy, but you should be able to read it )> > > > If you 
find the key is present in step 2 and not present in step 3, then th> at 
explains your problem. The quick fix is then to either remove the entry > from 
the registry hive in the default user profile or to create a policy wi> th the 
entry set to DISABLED.> > > > Note: If you fix the default profile without 
creating the DISABLED policy, > you will only fix new users, not existing 
users. You may be stuck with havi> ng a policy setting to disable the entry 
until all existing users have been> fixed. Since a user can have profiles on 
multiple machines, it is not “f> ixed” until all copies have been fixed.> > > > 
So… it’s all a bit messy. The moral of the story is either follow Darre> n’s 
advice and make sure no policies are applied to your default profile,> or else 
ensure the NTUSER.pol is always copied across as well.> > > > Alan Cuthbertson> 
> > > > > Policy Management Software:-> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=pol_summary.shtml> > > > 
ADM Template Editor:-> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=adm_summary.shtml> > > > 
Policy Log Reporter(Free)> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=policyreporter.shtm> l> > > 
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> ehalf Of Darren Mar-EliaSent: 
Wednesday, 28 November 2007 6:53 AMTo: gptalk> @freelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] 
Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set> to 'Not Configured'> > > > Here’s 
what I would do. If you have a vanilla XP image, just copy the def> ault 
profile from c:\documents and settings\default user up to the Netlogon> share, 
over the existing one, using the System control panel applet. Then > you can 
customize it however you want by removing shortcuts, etc. > > > > Darren> > > > 
> > > > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] 
On B> ehalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAINSent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 11:34 AMTo: 
gptalk> @freelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set> to 'Not Configured'> > > > Darren, Okay, i'm going to look into doing this 
tonight hopefully. Do i tak> e the NTUSER.dat file of a new user created while 
the PST setting was set t> o disabled? My confusion is around the fact that to 
create another Template> User I will have to create another Domain User and if 
I do this, the regis> try setting for the ForcePST path will already have been 
set to the network> location... Doesn;t this mean this setting will then go 
into the template?> > > > > > > > From: darren@xxxxxxxxxxxx: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: Proble> m with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007> 09:53:53 -0800> > > > Well, you 
only need to recreate the ntuser.dat file as that is where the po> licy 
settings are held, but it may just be easier to do the whole thing and> then 
manually remove what you need to. > > > > And yes, all existing users who 
already have profiles will not get affected> —only new users creating new 
profiles will pick up the new defaults.> > > > Darren> > > > > > > > From: 
gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> ehalf Of 
TAZAMAL HUSSAINSent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 9:44 AMTo: gptalk@> 
freelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set > to 
'Not Configured'> > > > Darren... I get you... So i;m sure new users are 
getting there Default prof> ile from netlogon, as a Default User profile does 
exist there. Should I tr> y and re-create this to keep troubleshooting? If I 
do, will all existing us> ers still keep the settings they have today 
(primarily all rubbish removed > from start menu and desktop etc etc)... I 
expect they will keep the setting> s (which is what I want).... > > > > > > > > 
From: darren@xxxxxxxxxxxx: gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: Proble> m 
with GPO Setting even after set to 'Not Configured'Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007> 
09:32:03 -0800> > > > Tazamal-> > Yes, what we’re saying is that wherever your 
default user profile is gett> ing built from, that is likely where the setting 
is stuck. There are two pl> aces this can come from. If you have a default 
profile up in your Netlogon > share on your domain controllers, then a new user 
logging into a workstatio> n for the first time will have their user profile 
created under %userprofil> e%\<username> on the workstation based on that 
default profile. If you have> n’t put a default profile under Netlogon, then 
the user grabs it from c:\> documents and settings\default user on the 
workstation that they log onto. > So I suspect, depending upon your situation, 
its coming from one of those > two places.> > > > Darren> > > > > > > > > > 
From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> 
ehalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAINSent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 9:21 AMTo: gptalk@> 
freelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set > to 
'Not Configured'> > > > All, I'm not sure i understand the question (a bit slow 
like that)... so I > will atempt to answer it. These test users where created 
by right clicking > in the OU where I placed them and creating a new account (i 
have also copie> d existin accounts and the get same results). These domain 
users, i guess t> hen when they log into an xp desktop I get their profile from 
the domain de> fault user profile (??) and not the local All Users profile on 
the desktop > (??). I created this a while back by creating a new user, logging 
in, confi> guring desktop, logging out, logging in as admin and copying the 
profile to> the domain somewhere... I can get the details if it helps, i tend 
to docum> ent everything. So are you saying that the domain default profile is 
where > this stuck setting could be? Have i answered your question? Sorry have 
been> slow to emails today...> > > > > > > > From: darren@xxxxxxxxxxxx: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: Proble> m with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007> 17:29:04 -0800> > > > Looking at 
the doc, it sounds like this setting is stuck in the user’s pr> ofile, as Alan 
had suggested. How are your new user’s profiles created? M> y guess is that 
they are created from a template Default User Profile that > has that path 
stuck in it.> > > > Darren> > > > > > > > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> ehalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAINSent: 
Monday, November 26, 2007 5:00 PMTo: gptalk@f> reelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] 
Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set t> o 'Not Configured'> > > > Alan, 
Darren, Jamie.... Your responses and guidance has been very much appr> eciated. 
I've done some screen scrapes to try and eliminate any things you > guys may 
think i might be doing wrong... I hope these help us find a soluti> on. I have 
attached a file, its not too big, hope you dont mind... Thanks > so far on the 
quick responses so far. Lozz> > > > > > > > From: darren@xxxxxxxxxxxx: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] Re: Proble> m with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007> 16:23:32 -0800> > > > Alan-> > 
Just to clarify, ntuser.pol should not exist in a default profile. It is cr> 
eated on the fly (both per-user and per-computer) for a given user and, as > 
you correctly point out, contains the admin template policy settings (as we> ll 
as preferences by the way) for the current user. The per-user version is> held 
in the current user’s profile directory. It is responsible for the > policy 
clean up process inasmuch as each time Admin. Template policy is pro> cessed, 
this “archive” file is read and any policy keys found in it are> removed before 
the current Admin. Template policies are re-applied. So it > is possible that 
this .pol file somehow did not get the policy in question > added to it, and 
thus would not remove it. But this seems like a strange sc> enario.> > > > 
Darren> > > > > > > > > > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On B> ehalf Of Alan & MargaretSent: 
Monday, November 26, 2007 3:19 PMTo: gptalk@f> reelists.orgSubject: [gptalk] 
Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set t> o 'Not Configured'> > > > Can 
you try removing the registry key manually, then reapplying the policy > and 
see if it comes back?> > > > What I suspect you may have done is got your 
default Profile screwed up. Th> ere are two files in the Default profile, the 
NTUser.dat file which contain> s the registry keys that are in use, plus the 
NTUser.Pol file that stores a> ll of the non-tattooed polices that are to be 
removed. If these get out of > synch, you can have the case that NTUser.dat 
contains a registry key but NT> User.Pol doesn't contain the key for removal. 
This will happen if when buil> ding the default profile, you copy across 
NTuser.dat but not NTUSER.POL> > > > This means that new users inherit a 
registry which contains the key but the> NTUSER.POL does not contain the key to 
remove it as part of tattoo process> ing. However, once you manually remove it, 
it wont come back. While the bes> t way to fix it for new users is to rebuild 
your Default profile from scrat> ch, if this is the only error, you can simply 
remove the entry from the NTU> SER.DAT. Existing users are somewhat harder to 
fix. I suspect the only way > is a batch file that removes the key on a once of 
basis. The trouble is tha> t you need to leave it running until all profiles on 
all machines have been> fixed., > > > > Alan Cuthbertson> > > > > > Policy 
Management Software:-> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=pol_summary.shtml> > > > 
ADM Template Editor:-> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=adm_summary.shtml> > > > 
Policy Log Reporter(Free)> > 
http://www.sysprosoft.com/index.php?ref=activedir&f=policyreporter.shtm> l> > > 
> > > > > -----Original Message-----From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-> bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Nelson, Jamie R Contr 72 
CS/SCBAFSent: T> uesday, 27 November 2007 4:21 AMTo: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx: [gptalk] R> e: Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not Configured'> > > > Then, as Darren suggested, you need to run a 
RSoP on that system/user> > and ensure you're not getting it from somewhere 
else. Eliminate that> > possibility first.> > > > Also, are you sure GP is 
processing correctly on the system? When you> > run your RSoP, check and see if 
any GP related events occurred.> > > > Regards,> > Jamie Nelson> > > > 
-----Original Message-----> > From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
[mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]> > On Behalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAIN> > Sent: 
Monday, November 26, 2007 11:12 AM> > To: gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Subject: 
[gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set to 'Not> > Configured'> > 
> > Hi Jamie,> > > > Yup... gave that a go.. rebooted few times etc but still 
that setting is> > coming down and shown in the user registry hive. Within the 
GPMC> > settings view of the defdompol, there is no sign that this setting> > 
(ForcePST) is now set... and the only GPO applied to this User is> > 
defdompol... > > > > Thanks for you reply> > > > Loz > > > > > Subject: 
[gptalk] Re: Problem with GPO Setting even after set to 'Not> > Configured'> > 
> Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 10:58:51 -0600> > > From: 
Jamie.Nelson.ctr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > To: gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > Have 
you done a 'gpupdate /force /target:user' from the command-line?> > > Sometimes 
if you forcefully reapply the policy it will correct things> > > like that.> > 
> > > > Regards,> > > Jamie Nelson> > > > > > -----Original Message-----> > > 
From: gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:gptalk-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]> > > On 
Behalf Of TAZAMAL HUSSAIN> > > Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 5:36 PM> > > To: 
gptalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > Subject: [gptalk] Problem with GPO Setting even after 
set to 'Not> > > Configured'> > > > > > Hi Guys,> > > > > > I have also posted 
this to Group Policy Forums @ Microsoft. Trying to> > > get some exposure to 
this problem... hoping someone can shed some> > light.> > > I have tried to 
describe exactly what is going on being a descriptive> > as> > > possible. If I 
get an answer on the on the Microsoft forum i'll post> > it> > > over to here 
if anyone is interested.... > > > > > > I have pasted the Thread I have started 
already:> > > > > > > > > 2 posts altogether:> > > > > > Hey Guys,> > > > > > > 
> Okay, although I have not found an answer yet, I *think* I have made> > > 
some > > > > progress and am on the right lines, again if anyone has any 
comments> > > please > > > > do let me know.> > > > > > > > .... after a lot of 
googling everything was pointing to the fact> > that> > > I MUST > > > > HAVE 
at some point applied the Outlook ADM to the def-dom-pol with> > the> > > > > > 
> setting for 'default path for PST Files' pointing to my network> > > 
location. > > > > After applying it I must have ripped out the ADM template 
from the > > > > def-dom-pol and applied it specifically to the OU where I 
wanted the> > > GPO to > > > > apply. Hence this *probably* caused GPMC to give 
the output of> > > 'display names > > > > for some setting cannot be 
found....'> > > > > > > > So... in an attempt to correct this.... Within the 
def-dom-pol I> > added> > > the > > > > Outlook ADM template back in... And set 
the setting for the PST path> > > to 'not > > > > configured'.. . Rebooted an 
XP client, logged in with a new user but> > > still > > > > outlook is pushing 
the path of the PST to the network store when> > > configuring a POP3 email 
account.> > > > > > > > The strange thing still is even though I have 
configured the setting> > > now to > > > > 'Not Configured' (and hence it does 
not now display in the GPMC> > > settings tab > > > > for the def-dom-pol GPO 
as being set at all) AND the ONLY policy> > that> > > is > > > > applied to 
Users (for new users created after this change as well)> > is> > > the > > > > 
def-dom-pol ONLY, the users registry hive is still showing the> > network> > > 
location path in the > > > > ForcePST registry key under > > > > 
HKCU\Software\Policies\Microsoft\Office\Outlook..... which I thought> > > was a 
> > > > protected registry area that doesn;t suffer from tatooing i.e.... is> > 
> this > > > > tatooing? > > > > > > > > My head is kind of spinning now... as 
i think i am getting out of my> > > depth... > > > > any steer would be great. 
All i am looking to achieve is for users> > > (not within a specific OU) 
default outlook PST path to point to where> > it> > > would have pointed if I 
didn;t mess with this setting... its as if the> > > default PST location value 
is now the network path if I leave this> > > setting to 'Not Configured'> > > > 
> > > > lozza > > > > > > > > > > > > 'lozza' wrote:> > > > > > > > > Hi Guys,> 
> > > > > > > > > I am confused by what is going on here.... looking for some 
help:> > > > > > > > > > In AD i have an OU with a GPO applied. This GPO, as 
well as other> > > user> > > > > settings, sets User 
Configuration\Administrative Tools\Microsoft> > > Office > > > > > Outlook 
2003\Miscellaneous\PST Settings\Default location for PST> > > files.... to > > 
> > > a network location (I dont have any other option!). Now my> > > 
understanding was > > > > > that this should apply to all users within the OU 
that is GPO is> > > linked to... > > > > > and it does, just fine, was happy 
until today> > > > > > > > > > However....> > > > > > > > > > When I create a 
new user in AD, and place him in any other OU that> > > does not > > > > > have 
this GPO linked to it (and only the Default domain Policy),> > > this setting > 
> > > > still applies to the user when configuring outlook... it> > shouldn't,> 
> > should it?> > > > > > > > > > So... I went into GPMC, clicked the OU the 
user sits in on the> > left> > > hand side, > > > > > clicked 'Group Policy 
Inheritance' tab on the right pane and see> > > that ONLY > > > > > the Default 
Domain Policy is being applied... which it should> > be...> > > good> > > > > > 
> > > > So... I clicked on the Default domain policy on the left hand side> > > 
pane of > > > > > GPMC and on the right hand side pane clicked the settings 
tab> > which> > > shows me > > > > > all configured settings within this GPO. 
AND THERE IT WAS! under> > > User > > > > > Configuration, Administrative 
Templates, Extra Registry Settings> > it> > > says:> > > > > > > > > > 'Display 
names for some settings cannot be found. You might be> > able> > > to > > > > > 
resolve this issue by updating the .ADM files used by Group Policy> > > > > > > 
Management' > > > > > > > > > > and directly under that it specifies:> > > > > 
> > > > > Setting:> > > 
Software\Policies\Microsoft\Office\11.0\Outlook\ForcePSTPath> > > > > State: 
\\Network File server where PSTs are stored in the GPO its> > > configured > > 
> > > for...> > > > > > > > > > So why is this setting, that is set in another 
GPO specifically> > > linked to one particular OU also in my Default Domain 
Policy? When I> > > > > open the defdompol to configure it I dont see the 
template that> > sets> > > this setting, in fact I dont see any of the 
Microsoft > > > > > Office stuff in the defdompol GPO as I didn't add any 
additional> > > administrative templates to the Default Domain GPO.> > > > > > 
> > > > Truly confused and a bit worried that I've messed my default> > domain 
> > > > > policy... does anyone know what i;m talking about?> > > > > > > > > > 
Lozz> > > > > > > > > ________________________________> > > > > > The next 
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