Allen D The data given here -- http://www.krysstal.com/solarsys_moon.html -- are among what makes me think it is relevant. I really wish you would try to engage in debate instead of just trying to blind your adversary with words. Wouldn't it be easier to put together a few well crafted sentences than to spend the time that you do bashing out hundreds of words which are well nigh indecipherable? The latter certainly does not generate anything but uncertainty in the minds of your readers. If I were to address your issues, I'd spend perhaps 95 - 97 per cent of my effort in just trying to clarify what you are saying before trying to grasp your meaning. You've been told this many times by those who interact with you yet you seem not to profit from this. Is it any wonder that others -- including myself -- do not respond directly to your statements/questions? So again -- is this for the third time? -- what is the defining difference between the two cases which causes the Moon to have just one motion and Uranus to have two motions? Not knowing what you consider this to be, I don't know how I would define this but I suspect that I could do it in less than 33 words. Are you smarter than me or dumber than me? And concerning librations. This phenomenon is principally the result of a constant rate of rotation combined with the varying rate of revolution found in an elliptical orbit. Consult Newton and Copernicus for details. In any event, it has no relevance to the matter at hand, that is to say -- what is the defining difference between the two cases which causes the Moon to have just one motion and Uranus to have two motions? Paul D PS It really doesn't matter what you say in response to this question because the Crushing Demonstration is coming this month. ________________________________ From: "allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx" <allendaves@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Friday, 2 January, 2009 3:05:24 PM Subject: [geocentrism] Uranus Paul, What makes you think any of this is relevant, logically , mechanically, or conceptually? The moon is a sphere....on what bases are you claiming it axis is offset wrt the orbital plane..every particle in the moon lay in the moons orbital plane so what is the point of your diagram?.....The axis & the moons "tilt" you are referring to that is offset is and is defined by the moonslibrations........That axis of the moons librations lay 90 degrees to the plane of that motion.....I have already covered; they are not under consideration; nor are they in question as rotations(they are) ; nor are they even relevant.. ...why?... ..because every particle in the moon either does or does not lay in the moons orbital plane, the axis of the orbital plane runs through the earth where the comon point of that orbital play lay....…we the moons orbit is a distinct and separate motion from its librations...one simple does not affect or define the other...…The axis of the moons orbital rotation lay 90 degrees wrt the orbital plane...the other planes & axis of any of the moons other motions/rotations/librations are irrelevant wrt each other…..The orbital plane defines the axis of the moons orbital/rotational axis not the moons tilt or librations or any other axis of any other rotation that the moon could have even if it were to begin spinning in a complexly different direction....the new motion would be defined by the axis of that rotation and would not be affected by the moons orbital rotation in any shape form or fashion....... regardless of any other motions the moons has, every particle of the moon individually or as a whole makes a progressive radial orientation to a point that lay at the earth.....any and all other axis of rotations parallel or offset do not change that fact no matter how many rotations exist for any given body.....The number and offsets for any number of rotations within a given body simply has nothing to do with whether or not the other rotations exist or not….The moons orbital plane defines where the axis of orbital rotation is not the “moons tilt”.. that “tilt” is defined by the moons librations or back and fourth rotations…one has nothing to do with; nor affects the definition of; nor affects the reality of the other. ........I don’t see how this can be so difficult for anyone to grasp either logically or conceptually..... You keep looking at things that have no relevance to the issue at hand…… look at the diagram Parent “1” it is a fundamental expose of the nature of a Rotation within a given body and as an extension any number of bodies that are “connected” via a solid substance or “gravity”, the principle is exactly the same….that diagram is relevant for any and all rotations even multiple rotations within a single body…. The number of rotations and any differences that the axis have or lay wrt each other is irrelevant for what determines a rotation…. Happy new year everyone... --- On Fri, 1/2/09, Allen Daves <allendaves@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: From: Allen Daves <allendaves@xxxxxxxxx> Subject: Re: [geocentrism] Uranus To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Friday, January 2, 2009, 7:03 AM --- On Thu, 1/1/09, Paul Deema <paul_deema@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: From: Paul Deema <paul_deema@xxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [geocentrism] Uranus To: Geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date: Thursday, January 1, 2009, 11:25 AM Allen D Please examine the attached "CommonPoint.png" illustration. You are on record as saying that the Moon has only one motion -- a rotation (defined as "A progressive radial orientation to a common point") and that that common point "... lay outside the Moon itself at the Earth ...". Further, you have also stated that "... every axis lay 90 degrees to the plane of the motion in question ...". As shown in the illustration, these two statements are in conflict as regards the Earth/Moon -- the plane of the Moon's rotation (that motion which is at 90 deg to its axis) passes through the Earth for only part of its orbit, exactly as for Uranus. Though the ratio of intersection to non-intersection is different, the fact of intersection and non-intersection is identical. So I ask again -- what is the defining difference between the two cases which causes the Moon to have just one motion and Uranus to have two motions? Paul D ________________________________ Stay connected to the people that matter most with a smarter inbox. Take a look. Stay connected to the people that matter most with a smarter inbox. Take a look http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/smarterinbox