I agree Nevile, I would suggest the following change for simplicity..? ( see attached)..although the base line means that we can look at the axis from any location on the earth, it does matter where the ecliptic axis really is I think this is important because moving from one side of the globe to the other side does not parallax the ecliptic axis even though we may view it from anywhere on the globe and see the same thing. I?m also convinced that is a point of misunderstanding for many..(The difference between viewing a axis and where the axis is in reality & why that is important)........I?m including mine here for you Ja so as to make my garbled words clear as mud,...(It was drawn in 3d too, notice the earth is not facing the same side in each view as well as the shine point hehhehehhe) ..... but It is not as cool as yours!.....:D Neville Jones <njones@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: JA, So confident am I that your upgraded 3D diagram will illustrate both necessary (HC) rotations, that I would like to ask for your permission to use it on the Celestial Poles web page. Full credit will be given to you, of course, unless you do not wish it to be. (For the purpose of such accrediting, perhaps you could supply your name, unless you are happy with "Picture by JA" !) You, Allen, Jack and others have produced fine diagrams, but perhaps the 3D nature of yours will make it the most suitable for the paper. (Jack came close, too, with his 3D effort. And Allen will use his own diagrams for his own pages, no doubt, since they are of very high quality and contain a lot of information.) If we can get this issue settled in the positive (from an anti-HC point of view), then we should all attempt to broadcast it as fast and as widely as possible. Neville www.GeocentricUniverse.com --------------------------------- Free 3D Earth Screensaver Watch the Earth right on your desktop! Check it out at www.inbox.com/earth