[geocentrism] Re: Evolution

Dear Philip,
We are all arrogant whether we like it or not. You are arrogant about Roman 
Catholicism, Neville is arrogant about geocentrism and I am arrogant my faith 
and geocentrism, which includes creation. We all believe we are correct (have 
knowledge of the truth) therefore we either agree to disagree or we express 
ourselves and beliefs in an arrogant way. ultimately God will be the judge.

Question:
How complicated must something get before it is considered 'un-designed'? Or 
put another way;
What is the minimum that can be removed from a 'biological' organism that will 
allow it to be considered designed? 

My Thoughts:
I suspect that the difference will reduce down to whether it is 'alive' or not. 
I then ask myself, what then is it about being 'alive' that would make it 
un-designed?  


Jack 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: philip madsen 
  To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 10:09 PM
  Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Evolution


  That's my whole point Philip, even you can't see it! Our own bodies are a 
living testimony to a fantastic complex creation that cannot be compared to a 
bucket, spade, computer or even a crab. Jack.

  Dear Jack ,


  Are you not being rather arrogant almost insulting in predisposing yourself 
as the ultimate perfection in the ability to reason. It is you who have limited 
your rational science as to what you call "complexity of order" whereas I and 
others can see it more clearly as a complexity of disorder. 

  Let me put it differently.  It is not perfect. In a very small way man has 
perfected some of these imperfections. The Polio Vaccine is just one example 
that comes to mind, saving millions and millions of childrens lives. The 
disorder in nature even fights this simple intervention, as new deseases 
develope. 

  I know that if I were to ask you to explain some of this your response should 
be , 
  It is written, 'Who can divine the ways of the Lord......my ways are not your 
ways..  etc.

  You cannot see what I and others can see. Whereas the bucket and the computer 
are ordered and symetrical, almost perfect designs (they do what they were 
designed to do always) ,  life and the cosmos by its complexity is not ordered, 
but the opposite, wildly disordered, lacking any evident design or purpose 
other than experimentation . 

  You are indeed like the person who would think the "volcano is a god". 

  I wonder and worry that your faith could withstand being truely enlightened 
in science, based as it is upon your claim to superior intellectual reasoning 
capability. It is not a sound base upon which faith is built. 
  27 But the foolish things of the world hath God chosen, that he may confound 
the wise: and the weak things of the world hath God chosen, that he may 
confound the strong. 

  Perhaps this is the reason why there are so many opposing varieties in the 
world today claiming to be the true religion. People consider themselves too 
wise, and too strong...

  Philip. 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: Jack Lewis 
    To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
    Sent: Sunday, September 30, 2007 7:39 PM
    Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Evolution


    Dear Philip,
    See all below.

    -- Original Message ----- 
      From: philip madsen 
      To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
      Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2007 11:47 PM
      Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Evolution


      I cant agree Jack..  Paul already has his own body to observe, which is 
far more complicated than a crabs, without going to the beach. Biological items 
cannot be compared with inamimate objects such as a bucket or a computer. 

      That's my whole point Philip, even you can't see it! Our own bodies are a 
living testimony to a fantastic complex creation that cannot be compared to a 
bucket, spade, computer or even a crab. So why do you stop at common sense 
reasoning as soon a 'life' (biology) is the subject? You're postion is no 
different than Jacques Monod, whose book was trounced by Wilder-Smith.

      Jack


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