[geocentrism] Re: Aether effects

  All EMP are vibrations and the magnetic force lines too resonate just as 
sound is a vibration through air EMP and all other magnetic force lines are 
vibrations ..just like gravity is a vibration the only difference between them 
is the frequencies and what enables all those various ranges of frequencies to 
form and propagate some so small ordinary mater cannot interact directly with 
(wavelength shorter then any ordinary mater) and so large ordinary mater cannot 
detect directly (wavelength larger then any ordinary mater) ...........is I 
would argue the aether...and although ordinary Hydrogen cannot perceive these 
vibrations directly, these vibrations still affect ordinary maters interactions 
with other mater as well as the various forms of energy. That is why the energy 
capacity in the Aether although infinitely greater then the energy stored in 
ordinary matter does not achieve equilibrium because the frequency range and 
the degree to which that transmission of energy in
 those frequencies is limited. Certain frequencies allow for motion while 
others allow for electromagnetic effects while yet others preclude the 
possibility of thermal equilibrium even though there is a energy 
leak/manifestation of 3.5degreesK in the background radiation which it self 
propagates at a given frequency range.. Regardless of how hot the aether is you 
can only see 3.5degreesK. of it which when you thing about it further 
demonstrates the extremely low efficiency of energy transmission from aether to 
matter assuming that the 3.5 degrees is not just the amount of heat energy that 
is transported in the aether but actually represents some of the energy of the 
aether?.?


philip madsen <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:      Allen I should have 
explained it better.  To understand light propagation , I prefer to use radio 
because the longer wavelength, and the antenna elements are more practical to 
examine. 
   
  You know what I mean if I said that if a unit North pole were placed near to 
a North magnetic pole it would be repelled away even through a vacuum. (it has 
nowhere else to go)
   
  In the case of radio EMR the transmitting element produces a sequence (at the 
given frequency) of electrically and magnetically polarised "envelopes" . which 
are aligned with "like" polarities opposing , which as a result repell each 
other away from the antennae. these have no weight, hence the speed of 
propagation is at the speed of light. Why this limitation is another subject, 
our aether, and not involved in this current explanation. 
   
  So I meant that because of the law of like poles repel, the generated 
envelopes of electromagnetic energy as electrical and magnetic lines of force 
in quadrature have nowhere else to go but be repelled away from the continueing 
successive like polarity envelopes and from the antenna itself.  As these 
envelopes of force move further away from the centre, they have to stretch ..  
This is the action which mathmatically gives us the inverse square law.  The 
fields are contiguous, and contradicts any idea of a corpuscle or particle 
   
  So that is why I said  it can only go one way and that is away from the 
source. and by way of explaining that this could happen without the need for 
any hypothetical fluid medium. 
   
  This still leaves us with the need to explain how force acts through 
(supposedly) empty space.. to which I offered elsewhere, IT IS NOT REALLY EMPTY.
   
  The antiaetherans try to say that the field is itself an entity..  This I 
reject as pure supposition.  The field is a ficticious entity used to explain 
the action of a force. Lines of force are graphical representation of this 
action.  I expect that to be understood in my explanation above, lest I be seen 
to contradict myself. 
   
  On an aside, you said,
  If it has nowhere to go it might not go anywhere just as sound dose not 
travel in a vacuum my voice would have no where to go and thus it would go 
nowhere.
   
  Sound is a ficticious word.. It is a subjective thing like sight..  It is the 
biological animals reaction as hearing of a vibration. But the nature of 
physical vibration cannot be anything but analogously compared to 
electromagnetic cycles, which cannot be technically called a vibration. If the 
vibration of your voice was converted into electrical cycles, it would indeed 
be propagated in a vacuum. 
   
  This is the reason why there are regulations controlling the audio power in 
the hearing aid loops of theatres and buildings.  Why ? because they can 
interfere with radio reception in aircraft that may be overhead...  
   
  Philip.   
    ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Allen Daves 
  To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Thursday, April 26, 2007 1:37 AM
  Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Aether effects
  

  Comments in blue
  (p)"EMR propagates because it has nowhere to go but away from its source. Its 
exactly like two like poles trying to occupy the same space. It is self 
propagating. Its wave like properties, is due to the nature of the two fields 
of which it is composed.. they stretch." 
   
  1. If it has nowhere to go it might not go anywhere just as sound dose not 
travel in a vacuum my voice would have no where to go and thus it would go 
nowhere.
  2.Experiments demonstrate something that has properties doing something that 
makes it hard to write it off as just nothing.
  3. Scripture plainly outlines a Something out there that every thing out 
there is imbedded into...


philip madsen <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:           Martin, first up I 
want to say that I have the utmost respect for you, as I have come to 
experience your written word. Whilst I may not accept all that you teach, or 
say, you have been a cause in re-igniting my curiosity to learn and venture in 
new directions of all philosophy in science.  I admire your command of the 
language. Thus it is in the spirit of learning and of my ignorance, that I make 
the following comment. 
   
   You seem to be trying very hard to make the aether fit with some quantistic 
theory to make it conform with the ancient hypothesis of the aether being a 
hypothetical medium/fluid with properties that are due to a special type of 
material  ..Why are you opposed to the idea that it does not have to be a 
material substance at all, and that wave propagation "through"  it is due to an 
entirely different and new concept.  I said "through" in quotation marks 
because I dispense with the term medium. 
   
  EMR propagates because it has nowhere to go but away from its source. Its 
exacly like two like poles trying to occupy the same space. It is self 
propagating. Its wave like properties, is due to the nature of the two fields 
of which it is composed..  they stretch. 
   
  OK yes I know you were about inertia and momentum, not EMR but, 
   
  Why does "aether" have to be a special material with a new and special 
viscosity, that applies differently to matter at constant velocity  to that 
which has acceleration? 
   
  Last time I heard viscosity is a property inherent to a fluid.
   
  You seem to be trying to invent a fluid (via quantum mechanics) with 
discretionary properties as regards inertia, which to my mind means it is not a 
fluid at all. At the practical level for the purpose of trying to prove a 
fluids existence perhaps that makes for a possible hypotheses, but maybe 
unnecessarily so. 
   
  Somehow it seems to me that we must get back to basics from scripture when 
trying to reason out how a geocentric universe can rotate with an aetheric 
firmament. To venture into using quantum theory to explain it appears to me to 
be no different to those creation scientists who try to justify evolution as 
intelligent design, on the one hand and on the other try to prove the universe 
is new , of only 7000 years or so old..  
   
  This latter way of thinking is of the Devil, at worst, or a weakness of faith 
at best, because it denies the omnipotent God as having the power to create a 
natural world. A world that would need in the natural order of science at least 
millions of years to have developed  IF He had so desired to do it that way. BUT
   
  God  tells us specifically that He side stepped all of that developement and 
created the world in six days, and it was an aged universe that he created, 
with light shining from stars that were light years away..  Yes for the 
unimaginative among you I say, he put in place in an instant the stars, with 
rays of light that were light years long, to shine on the earth in that day. 
This probably was the only time ever, when light was made to travel at infinite 
speed.
   
  Likewise He said , and I know I am being repetitive, "Before Abram was I AM. 
" 
   
  To me that explains the aether, or else I am truly nuts.  
   
  Philip. 
    ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Martin G. Selbrede 
  To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx 
  Sent: Wednesday, April 25, 2007 8:51 AM
  Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Aether effects
  


    On Apr 24, 2007, at 5:21 PM, Dr. Neville Jones wrote:

    If maximons DO couple with matter:
   
  My original point was that if material objects are carried along by a 
rotating aether (such that net kinetic energy imparted is zero, as you state), 
then there must be a noticeable effect when those objects travel through, or 
against, this aether (even allowing for Allen's novel suggestion of currents 
within the aether), for then the flux must produce far more maximons "pushing 
against" our material object. 
  

  This was what Markov was countering in regard to a liquid composed of 
maximons. This liquid has the intriguing property of having zero viscosity with 
regard to constant velocities, but non-zero viscosity in reaction to objects 
with changing velocities. (Again, I personally don't hold to either a LeSagean 
gas or a Markov liquid, but the extreme density form of these two models, where 
the mean free path constrains the underlying aetherons -- of whatever 
construction -- to stay localized near their current lattice positions due to 
crowding from their neighbors. The net flux through any material object is 
always zero: aether flux is conserved in this model, although the Bouw/Hanson 
approach to LeSage does not conserve flux since it treats matter as shielding 
that flux, rather than considering that matter shields acoustic pressure 
transmitted through the lattice. The effects are identical in either case, but 
with the rarefied aethers incumbent upon LeSage gas protagonists to
 support, there is no clear identification of the Planck Density with any 
element of the current universe at the subquantum domain. If these connections 
have been since established, I've not seen them reported.) 

     
  If maximons DO NOT couple with matter:
   
  How would such an aether carry any material object along within itself?
   


  
I think I mentioned this already, that inertial drag is to matter in the aether 
as Fresnel drag is to light rays in glass.    

  I think in all fairness, Neville, your task is complicated because every 
person here on the forum has a completely different idea of what the aether is 
and how it should behave. So, interacting with Allen may or may not translate 
to an adequate response to Martin, or to Phil.  You've got five blind men and 
an elephant, in effect. Your challenge, then, is to not tar with too broad a 
brush, but since knowledge of another person's views comes in to you piece-meal 
(usually by way of the person objecting to your criticisms), you've got 
something akin to vague, moving targets with poorly-defined outlines. So, I'm 
sympathetic with the challenges of pinning us aether guys down. It's like the 
old saw that if you have five economists, you'll have six opinions.
  

  Martin
  

  P.S.  This reminds me of a comedian's commentary about all the out-of-focus 
photos of the legendary Bigfoot here in North America:  "Bigfoot IS blurry. 
He's a creature with soft edges running around in the wilderness -- you can't 
get a sharp photograph of him."  So it is with the aether theorists.  The best 
you can do is pin one down at a time and figure out what his particular conceit 
is.  That's just the nature of the beast. No pun intended.
  

  

  

    
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