Try to be less disapointed please.=20 The system is not so bad and changing for another one is not so easy. I = know what i am talking about, because i have consulted for it 3 years = ago, and in function of your application it's very difficult to change = and save money. You wrote : "The new I/A falls in the category of "Not recommended for = new designs products" : i disagree with that. Actually, i would say that it's better = for new projects than for upgrade. You're right : a hole system is not so Cheap. I don't know where you work, but if you search a little, big DCS working = with Solaris are not so numerous !. Actually, they all work with = Windozzz or almost all. Invensys was one of the last to keep in life the = Solaris system. If you compare the price of a Solaris station (licence = included) and a windozz station, you see the difference. Of course you = have to add products like Switches, firewall and so on but it's not the = bigger problem. And i am not working in Invensys office. The big problem of invensys solution, is when you want to spread a = quickfix in a lot of stations or a committed configuration. You don't = have the ability to do it once for every one.=20 With winXP box, you need to reboot (in off plateform mode ) to do an IA = install. And after you need to reboot in operator mode. That's very = heavy for a simple act. Of course you loose a lot of things (remote foxview, self shell scripts = to re-adapt). And i will not say you win a lot.=20 I like IACC functionnalities : it's a central database. When you use it = with fowdraw, you can send files on each station at the same time. Even = if you have mix system : Solaris and windows. IACC converts files for = Solaris version. You don't work directly on the controler too. That's more safe Some one said a few weeks ago that it would have been clever to develop = all the application in Java so that it could be operationnal for Solaris = or Windowz (see Patrick Valentin mails): that was a good idea. Now talking about backup/restore : Invensys technicians use Ghost each = time they need to have a backup/Restore file before upgrading a station. = So I suppose they are confident with it !. They even use it for zero = install. For the rest, i would say that things are going too fast. For examples I = learned a few weeks ago that IACC (which is 4-5 years old) is already = "obsolet". Man talk about IEEE nowadays. Foxview seems to be at the end = of is life too. With infusion, we will see Intouch every where i suppose = ?. I have migrated all the plant to the new MESH network, with XPbox, = switches ... but i still keep my solaris box (AW51) for remote = applications (exceed, rlogin ...). How long ? I don't know.=20 best regards, keep on talking, just say it... Jean-Christophe MUTI -----Message d'origine----- De : foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]De la part de Pablo Lioi Envoy=E9 : Thursday, August 30, 2007 16:02 =C0 : foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Objet : [foxboro] RE : Barriers to migration to Windows To all the UNIX gurus migrating to Micro$oft Windoze, My first I/A was 6.1 under WinNT. It was the first time I worked with a = DCS,=20 as my previous experience only involved PLCs and SCADAs. At first I was shocked at the (unnecessary) complexity of the system (by = the=20 way I had no training and had to learn the hard way by myself), and one = of=20 the things I disliked most was the mix between Windoze and Unix=20 applications, exceed and the MKS toolkit. Don't get me wrong: I like = Unix,=20 Linux in particular, but I also like clean solutions. Windoze apps in=20 Windoze, Unix apps in Unix. Documentation didn't help much (I never knew = if=20 a manual like "human interface calls" applied only to Unix or was also=20 valid, at least to some extent, for the NT version). Anyway, one knew that out there there was THE REAL THING.... THE UNIX=20 VERSION, where all the weird things were natural, and I only had the = cheap=20 version of THE SYSTEM. Now Foxboro has decided to kill THE REAL THING, and we are left with the = latest version of THE CHEAP VERSION, which is not so cheap after all (we = paid $75000 for a Dell Server that is worth some $15000 for the rest of = the=20 world). I think that the least they should have done was to build the = whole=20 thing from scratch and do away with exceed, the emulated shell, ICC, = SYSTEM=20 MONITOR, etc. Besides, the performance of the 8.x system is the same or=20 worse as our previous 6.5.1 NT running on Pentium II PC's. It doesn't surprise me that migrated UNIX users are complaining about = the=20 things they have lost. And know what? They aren't going to get any=20 solutions. I've been training two young engineers during the last months. At times = it=20 is almost impossible to explain the way things are done in the I/A. If = you=20 can't find a good explanation for something, then it is probably done = the=20 wrong way. If I had to advise somebody I would say: - The new I/A falls in the category of "Not recommended for new designs" = products - If you have a small I/A system, and need to upgrade, consider changing = to=20 another product - If you have a large I/A system, and need to upgrade, well..... you are = dead, my friend. Regards Pablo Lioi _________________________________________________________________ Messenger Caf=E9 - open for fun 24/7. Hot games, cool activities served = daily.=20 Visit now. http://cafemessenger.com?ocid=3DTXT_TAGHM_AugHMtagline =20 =20 _______________________________________________________________________ This mailing list is neither sponsored nor endorsed by Invensys Process Systems (formerly The Foxboro Company). Use the info you obtain here at your own risks. Read http://www.thecassandraproject.org/disclaimer.html =20 foxboro mailing list: //www.freelists.org/list/foxboro to subscribe: = mailto:foxboro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=3Djoin to unsubscribe: = mailto:foxboro-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=3Dleave =20 _______________________________________________________________________ This mailing list is neither sponsored nor endorsed by Invensys Process Systems (formerly The Foxboro Company). Use the info you obtain here at your own risks. 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