Re: [foxboro] Pricing models (was: AIM*Historian Process Alarm Message Retrieval)

Sorry Alex, but in my case I could never have the ODBC text extraction working.
If those are the minimal functionalities  Invensys provide, they should be 
stable and have a user manual.
 
Just my opinion.
Claudio Pérez
Profertil S.A.
 
________________________________

De: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx en nombre de Johnson, Alex P (IPS)
Enviado el: Jue 06/12/2007 11:46 a.m.
Para: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Asunto: Re: [foxboro] Pricing models (was: AIM*Historian Process Alarm Message 
Retrieval)



In the case of AIM, we provide the "minimal" functionality through:

1) The use of OLE DB or ODBC feeding Excel for messages and =

2) The Data Display (and its command line interface) for real-time
values.

Both of these mechanisms can produce text files.

So, I think we do what you are asking or am I missing something?

Regards,

Alex Johnson
Invensys Systems, Inc.
10900 Equity Drive
Houston, TX 77041
713.329.8472 (voice)
713.329.1700 (fax)
713.329.1600 (switchboard)
alex.johnson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Lowell, Timothy
Sent: Thursday, December 06, 2007 5:46 AM
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [foxboro] Pricing models (was: AIM*Historian Process Alarm
Message Retrieval)

Alex,

I generally agree with the idea that Invensys should provide a la carte
pricing and licensing so that the customer can decide what they want to
buy to fit their needs.  However, in the case of the AIM*Historian, I
think the rule ought to be, whatever data you can put into it, Invensys
should provide a way, at no extra charge, to extract the data in a
text-based flat-file format.

For AIM*, this would include real-time data, alarms, operator actions,
and system monitor messages (an MDE data I suppose too).  Historians are
by definition a two-way operation; data goes in, and at some point the
data needs to come out (otherwise you wouldn't put it in there in the
first place).  I would think a flat-file text format is the most basic
way to extract data and should not incur extra licensing fees.  Now, if
you want anything fancy, like any kind of visualization other than a
basic trend, or some kind of standard database structure output, or any
data analysis tools, then sure, you should have to pay extra.  Many
companies use PI or IP21 or something similar for real time data and
Matrikon or PAS or LogMate for message data and don't want that
capability from AIM* and shouldn't have to pay for it.  But if you need
a quick, simple flat text file, the base software should include that
functionality for every data type.

Just my opinion,

Tim


----- Original Message -----
From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wed Dec 05 23:33:56 2007
Subject: [foxboro] Pricing models (was:  AIM*Historian Process Alarm
Message Retrieval)

In general, the company has taken the unbundled (ala carte) approach to
pricing and selling its products. The basic thought is that most clients
don't want the pieces that they don't intend to use bundled in to the
price they pay.

That is to say, rather than set a higher price for say AIM*AT Suite and
including everything, we set a price for each piece and allow the client
to chose what they want.

There is no doubt that this approach makes some clients sad, but the
other, bundled, approach will make a different group of clients equally
sad.

In this particular case, the vast majority of our clients do not buy
AIM*Inform (or AIM*AMI). I can only assume that those clients find the
OLE DB, ODBC, or Alarm History display to be sufficient.

This model applies to basically everything we sell today.

I'm not sure what the "right" answer is with regard to how to price. I
do know that this issue is a constant conversation in our company and in
many others.

I hope this helps.


Regards,

Alex Johnson
Invensys Systems, Inc.
10900 Equity Drive
Houston, TX 77041
713.329.8472 (voice)
713.329.1700 (fax)
713.329.1600 (switchboard)
alex.johnson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


-----Original Message-----
From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Airhart, Chad M.
Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 8:39 AM
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [foxboro] AIM*Historian Process Alarm Message Retrieval

Not to sound negative but why is that the answer so often.  If you know
users are going to want to do these things why can't the functionality
be built into the package instead of having to buy something else.
Disappointing is all I am saying.=3D3D20


Chad M. Airhart=3D3D20
Principal Engineer - Lyondell Chemical Co.=3D3D20
Instrument, Electrical and Control Systems Engineering=3D3D20
Victoria Plant=3D3D20
Ph. (361)572-2568=3D3D20
Fx. (361)572-2541=3D3D20
Cell. (361)935-3230

-----Original Message-----
From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Johnson, Alex P (IPS)
Sent: Tuesday, December 04, 2007 11:34 PM
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [foxboro] AIM*Historian Process Alarm Message Retrieval

AIM*Inform or its subset AIM*AMI will do it.
AJ


-----Original Message-----
From: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Hicks, Gaylon F
Sent: Tue 12/4/2007 11:59 PM
To: foxboro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [foxboro] AIM*Historian Process Alarm Message Retrieval
=3D3D20
Mighty List,

I must yet again bare my ignorance and laziness before the list.  My
goal appeared simple in the beginning, but it really hasn't worked out
well so far.  We've been using AIM* for only about six months here, and
it's ... different.

We are trying to extract the previous 24 hours of process alarm messages
from an AIM* historian to a text file for a daily report.  This needs to
run un-attended on an AW70 XP workstation running I/A version 8.2, from
the command line.  We have a daily script that runs in the morning via
the XP scheduler that this can be added to for pseudo-cron
functionality. =3D3D3D20

From the user documentation, there doesn't appear to be any utility that
will do that, and looking over the list archives I couldn't find a good
answer there either.  Does anyone have a reasonably simple way to do
this?  Any suggestions or ideas would be appreciated.  I have a sneaking
suspicion that the answer involves Visual Basic and/or Excel.

Thanks,
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D=
3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3
D3D=3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3
D=3D3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=
=3D3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D=
3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3
D3D=3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3
D=3D3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=
=3D3D3D3D
Gaylon Hicks
Tennessee Valley Authority, Browns Ferry Nuclear Plant Mail Stop SAB-1B
PO Box 2000 Decatur, AL 35609
Phone:(256) 729-7804 Fax:(256) 729-2047
email gfhicks@xxxxxxx
FedEx Address: Shaw Road & Nuclear Plant Road, Athens, AL 35611
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D=
3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3
D3D=3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3
D=3D3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=
=3D3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D=
3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3
D3D=3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3
D=3D3D
3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D=
=3D3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D

=3D3D20
=3D3D20
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