Re: [foxboro] Installing Foxboro IADay0 Ethernet / problem with Dell P4

I'm glad I'm not the only one that noticed the loss of functionality on an 
AW70 relative to an AW51.  I knew about some of it going in (the "virtual" 
CP in the AW70 had to be hosted on the AW70, configured on the AW70, 
etc.), but I can't copy files between the 70 and my other boxes unless I 
want to use FTP -- and that's only from the 70 out.  There is no 
capability to run ICC or other configuration tools from the 51s out of the 
box, even though Sysdef knows about those 51s.  The ancient version of 
Exceed on the NT AW70 appears to have an Rexec server, but I can't get it 
to work, and I haven't found any documentation on it, so there's no 
running the ICC on the 70 from the 51s.
I know I can roll my own solutions to many if not all of these problems, 
but I thought that the integration would be better.  I guess if you have 
an all-Windows system, you don't do configuration on anything but the 
host, unless you fork out for the Server 70 (Windows Terminal Server) 
version.

Other nits: the box came with a SCSI tape drive, and for some inane 
reason, Foxboro removed the IDE hard disk and used a SCSI one.  I needed 
the PCI slots (for Allen-Bradley DH+ cards and another Ethernet 
interface), and discovered that once you get the thing running, only a few 
config files need be backed up, so I ditched the tape and SCSI controller, 
put in an IDE drive and got it running.  I found out later that the box 
could be ordered with IDE everything.  Unfortunately, the XP version only 
comes with SCSI.  I hope the controller's on the motherboard.

Foxview cannot detect when Windows is being shut down.  So if you try to 
shut the box down from the Start menu or Task Manager, the box usually 
hangs.  You of course have to use the Shutdown pick in Foxview.  Maybe 
this is a "feature", to keep operators from making mistakes, but it's 
maddening in a gateway/engineering environment -- particularly when you 
are endlessly rebooting while setting everything up, as Windows makes you 
do.

I didn't know about the one IOGate restriction on XP, but we're doing 
everything via OPC.  I wonder if you can still talk to multiple OPC 
servers?

Oh well...off to preemptively reboot the AW70 to avoid the two-month 
lockup thing.  Have a good weekend, everyone.

Corey Clingo
BASF Corp.






tom.vandewater@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent by: foxboro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
03/26/2004 02:12 PM
Please respond to foxboro

              To:  foxboro 
              cc: 
         Subject:       Re: [foxboro] Installing Foxboro IADay0 Ethernet /  
problem with Dell P4






I have to agree with the overall sentiment on the list today about
Windoze vs. UNIX, but have to disagree with the statement:

"Of course Windoze seems to be the "cheaper" way to go from a capital
expenditure point of view..".

Through the use of 10 dual headed WP-51D's, and 20 dual headed PC's
running Exceed, coupled with the remote DM capability, we were able to
provide 30 dual headed workstations for use in our central control room. 
By
calling up remote DM's from the WP's, the PC's are dual use as control
system workstations and enterprise Windows based access points for
production related applications such as PI, email, SAP, and other 
pertinent
intranet/web based information required by our operating technicians.
Had we bought 30 Windows NT workstations instead, our software
license costs would have been excessive, coordinationg our software
installation efforts to work with the hardware installed would have been a
nightmare, the opportunity for the blue screen of death would be
ever-present, and loading the NT boxes with enterprise applications such 
as
PI would have been ill-advised.  Had we proceeded in that path we would 
now
have 30 NTWP's that were out of date as soon as the XPWP's were 
introduced.
In order to upgrade to the XP stations we would have to pay again for the
licensing and go through the headache of loading the software again.  If
somebody thinks that would be cheaper they are going to have to explain it
to me.

Because of Foxboro's decision to migrate all new apps such as IACC,
future Wonderware replacement of DM and Foxview, IO_Gates capability and
support, etc, I felt like we would be forced into the Microsoft world if 
we
were going to continue using Fox IA.  The future for UNIX on Fox IA
continues to look a bit bleak but experienced customers voicing their
concerns is the only hope we have of making it change.  Recently it was
released that Foxboro would support the Solaris 8 machines on the nodebus
instead of only on the high speed ethernet solution.  That is a small
indication that they may be seeing the light about problems associated 
with
Windoze.  However, I think they are too far down the MS path and it seems
unlikely they could reverse the decision.  Most of the ideas sounded good 
on
paper but bringing it to reality in an MS environment is much more
difficult.
We purchased and installed two XP-AW's on my recommendation in order
to experiment on a small scale with IACC as well as using the IOGate
functionality for Modbus/TCP and OPC data links to IA.  I was amazed at 
the
loss of some basic functionalities when we installed these boxes.  We have
been so used to pulling a remote DM from any WP51 or AW51 on our 
carrierband
and remotely entering the ICC on any CP hosted by any AW.  That isn't
possible on the XPAW.  You must do it from the boot host.  I can't even 
copy
a block from an AW51 hosted CP to an AWXP hosted CP. The XP boxes are only
single user capable.  If I wanted to use a remote desktop client to access
Foxview on the AWXP at the same time someone else wants to use it on the
local screen, it can't be done.  We are doing it everyday of the year on 
the
Solaris boxes using X-windows.
When I tried to load the IOGate software we had purchased, I found
out that I would have to contact a dedicated person and provide specific
information about what AW CSA ran on what AW the IOGate would run on and
then wait for them to give me information to put into a license text file 
on
the AW host before I could run the application.  If I want to move CSA or
move the IOGate to a different host I guess I have to reapply for license
info to manually type in the file to make it work.  After I got my
modbus/tcp IOGate working I started trying to get the OPC gate working.
Again I went through the license routine.  I thought I'd learned a lot
trying to get the Modbus gate working but I still was unable to get the 
OPC
gate going.  It was only by chance that the I found out that the XP box
could only run one gate at a time.  The NT boxes could do both.  It just
demonstrates what most people already know, and that is, even though they
are all MS Windows OS, there are a ton of potential pitfalls in assuming
that they will all be able to run the same applications.
That is my two cents worth on this Friday afternoon.  Have a good
weekend everyone.

Tom VandeWater
Control Systems Developer/Analyst
Dow Corning Corp.
Carrollton, KY USA





 
 
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